Channel Dash - JG2 losses

[keith A]

According to one database JG2 suffered 8 Bf109F losses on 12/02/1942, none due to enemy action. Given that the RAF claimed 14 Bf109 and 4 destroyed on that date can anyone explain how JG2 were so unlucky?

I know that JG26 lost one Bf109F and 3 Fw190A, at least three of these losses to Spitfires.

Keith

[Leo Etgen]

Hi Keith

According to Prien, JG 2 suffered seven incidents that day including two fighters lost and another two damaged due to fuel shortage, one fighter lost due to bad weather, one fighter damaged due to undercarriage failure and another fighter damaged when it lost direction while landing. The unit did not suffer any pilot casualties. I hope this helps.

Horrido!

Leo

[keith A]

Thanks Leo. Looking at the losses the ones that crash landed with undercarriage failure etc. seem ok, but two of the crashes are 85% damaged! Why did they land or crash land in so many different locations? I also have one "cause unknown". Given the level of combat of JG2 on this date it seems odd they suffered no significant (less than 10%) combat damage to any aircraft. I appreciate that there are questions about JG2 claims but assume their damage reports are accurate - but the causes? And no pilot details?

cheer-oh

Keith

[Bruce Lander]

Hi Keith,
I agree with you on this, I have noted quite a few occasions when RAF claims were made that no Luftwaffe combat losses were reported but several 109's or 190's force landed with "Tech Mangel" or some such other technical mechanical
problem had caused the aircraft to force land etc.

Given that we are always regaled with the fact that German Engineering is (and was) the finest in the universe I have always found it odd that Lufywaffe aircraft suffered so many technical problems!

Wow I suppose that this could be a controversial statement but we should remember that the Luftwaffe under Goering was, especially in 1940-42, a very
"Front Page" item and the very competitive nature of a fighter pilot would shy away from admitting any personal failing like being shot up.
Bruce Lander

[Leo Etgen]

Hi guys

The only pilot who is mentioned is Oberleutnant Erich Leie of the Geschwaderstab of JG 2. He had to belly-land his Bf 109 F-4 (W.Nr. 8338) at Strijen near Dordrecht due to fuel shortage and the aircraft was 15% damaged in the incident. He was unscathed in the incident. Two fighters are listed at 85% damage and another at 80% damage which would signify a total loss if my understanding of how the Luftwaffe accounting went is accurate (60% damage and above were total losses). The remaining aircraft are listed as having suffered 40%, 20% and 10% damage. I honestly can not speculate if JG 2 was misreporting its losses but to be entirely honest I feel that the most plausible explanation is that the RAF fighter pilots were simply overly optimistic in their claims. I hope this helps.

Horrido!

Leo

[Fredo Hara]

Originally Posted by keith A

According to one database JG2 suffered 8 Bf109F losses on 12/02/1942, none due to enemy action. Given that the RAF claimed 14 Bf109 and 4 destroyed on that date can anyone explain how JG2 were so unlucky?

I know that JG26 lost one Bf109F and 3 Fw190A, at least three of these losses to Spitfires.

Keith

Hello Keith,
It can be said that bad weather is the main responsibility. In "Dans le Ciel de France, JG2 Richthofen, Volume 3 : 1942" of Eric Mombeeck, for the 12/02/42, there are very lively testimonies of several pilots of the JG2 (like Bethke, Von Einsiedel, Fiby, Wenger or Bigge) which tells their "Donnerkeil" and the catastrophic meteorological conditions. Very very interesting !
Best Regards,
Fredo

[keith A]

Many thanks chaps.

I agree that over claiming by the RAF in the period 1941-42 was very high but my argument was regarding the high losses to technical difficulties reported by JG2. Bad weather is a possible argument.