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Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces Please use this forum to discuss the German Luftwaffe and the Air Forces of its Allies. |
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JG 53' "abschusse": 11/05/43
Hello all
11/05/43:reported fighting ACCORDING to different sources source Tony Wood (microfilms) Hptm.Gotz =1 P-38,12h24 W.Marsal Fw.Nairz= 1 Mitchell,12h25 N.W.Marsal Oblt.Schiess= 1 Mitchell,12h25 S.W.Marsal Fw.Kuehl (Kuhl?)= 1 P-38 12h50 S.W.Marsala source J.Prien (JG 53 History) Hptm.Gotz = 1 Spit Fw.Kuel = 1 P-38 Oblt.Roehring = 1 P-38 Uffz.Bahsen = 1 Spit Uff.Harnisch = 1 P-38 source C.Shores and Cie ( a history MEA vol.3) Hptm.Gotz = 1 B.25,12h24 W.Marsala Uffz.Bahnsen = 1 B.25,12h25 W.Marsala Uffz.Manz = 1 P-38,12h25 NE Marsala Fw.Kuhl = 1 B.26,12h50 W Marsala source J.L Roba (l'histoire de la JG53) 7 "abschusse" (4 P-38,2 Mitchell,1 Spit) with NO details. Is there anyone able to explain and decide in THIS "CIRCUS"!!!!....and I am polite! Best Regards michel |
#2
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Re: JG 53' "abschusse": 11/05/43
Hello Michel,
At least one P-38 was from 14th FG, found here...the place does match the claims SW of Marsala http://raf-112-squadron.org/14thfghonor_roll42_43.html Mentioned on page 405 of 16544, which is report # 16283 11-May-43 * . Chavis, Wayne M., FOD 12 May 44 O-728977 49FS 14FG 12AF KIA Entered the Service from, Arkansas, Tablets of the Missing at Sicily-Rome American Cemetery, Nettuno, Italy, Awards, Air Medal, Purple Heart, Missing enemy action Last seen upside down with left engine on fire. Not seen to crash. Approx. 1200 hrs., 15-20 mi. SW of Marsala. Pilot had prior service with 84FS, 78FG, based at Station 345, incident on 24 Jan 1943,* in 43-2178 at Goxhill/Sta 345, England . 11-May-43 . Another pilot claimed 2 victories over Bf 109 (?): Newman, William J O-421294 49FS 14FG 12AF Claims 2 victories |
#3
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Re: JG 53' "abschusse": 11/05/43
31st FG lost one Spitfire
http://raf-112-squadron.org/31stfghonor_roll43_44.html 1304 there are 2 planes with this MACR # other one is 42-5875 11 May 43 JK609 Spitfire VcT Frost, Edward*M Jr O-798121 308FS 31FG 12AF POW Plane Coded HL- L,. Location, Vicinity, S E Of Sulmona 10 Miles, Point Of Departure, Pomigliano A/D. North African Theatre: Italy. Stalag 7A Moosburg Bavaria 48-12 (Work Camps 3324-46 Krumbachstrasse 48011, Work Camp 3368 Munich 48-11). Returned to Military Control, Liberated or Repatriated |
#4
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Re: JG 53' "abschusse": 11/05/43
Michel,
Unfortunately I do not have access to the daily MACR, which could probably answer you accordingly. Maybe someone from the US do have them... The 14th FG actions could be a good start...maybe there were some airplanes damaged that returned and were wrongly claimed as victories...who knows? Cheerio Adriano |
#5
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Re: JG 53' "abschusse": 11/05/43
Hello Adriano,
according to the MACR 1304 the Spitfire Vc JK609 was lost on 5 November 1943, not 11 May 1943. In the JFV Vol. 11/II (Prien-Stemmer-Rodeike-Bock) are listed the following claims of the III./JG 53 on 11 May 1943: Stab III./JG 53 Hptm Franz Götz B-25 12.24 10 km west of Marsala confirmed 8./JG 53 Uffz Jens Bahnsen B-25 12.25 10 km west of Marsala confirmed 9./JG 53 Uffz Wilhelm Manz P-38 12.25 10 km northeast of Marsala not confirmed 9./JG 53 Fw Helmut Kühl B-26 12.50 10 km west of Marsala not confirmed. Regards Leo |
#6
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Re: JG 53' "abschusse": 11/05/43
Thank you all for yours efforts.
I am surprised and WARY about the facts reported. 5 sources.....4 versions!surely a record!! Michel |
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