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  #11  
Old 19th June 2009, 17:57
SALERNO1943 SALERNO1943 is offline
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Re: Dornier 217 crashed in Salerno 16 sept. 1943

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Bines View Post
There is another Do217K-2 lost with w.n. 4577, two crewmen were missing and two returned wounded but the date of this is the 13th. Sept. Is the number definitely 1577 ?
I believe II/KG100 were based at Istres and III/100 at Istres but also using Foggia in Sept 1943 but this is not definite.
Many thanks again. The number appear to be 1577. Tomorrow I'll do some photos of these new fragments. There is no Do217 with 1577 fallen in Salerno\Avellino area in sept. 1943?
Istres is in Italy? Or France? I not know.
Thanks.
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  #12  
Old 19th June 2009, 18:36
Brian Bines Brian Bines is offline
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Re: Dornier 217 crashed in Salerno 16 sept. 1943

Istres is N/W of Marseille. The details of the loss on 13th. Sept are Do217K-2 ZY+MA 4577 of III/KG100 Ff Oblt. Erwin Burghoff, B Uffz. Hans Bastian, Bf Fw.Leinhard Handwerker, Bs Ogef. Erwin Mutschler . They are all shown as missing in the Luft. QM's returns dated 26th Sept, admendments of report of 8th.Oct. then show the Ff and B as returned wounded and the Bf and Bs as 'gefallen'.
If the burial details of the two dead crewmen are known and are near the crash site it might help indentify whether this loss is a possibility for the aircraft you are looking for.
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  #13  
Old 20th June 2009, 16:05
SALERNO1943 SALERNO1943 is offline
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Re: Dornier 217 crashed in Salerno 16 sept. 1943

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Bines View Post
Istres is N/W of Marseille. The details of the loss on 13th. Sept are Do217K-2 ZY+MA 4577 of III/KG100 Ff Oblt. Erwin Burghoff, B Uffz. Hans Bastian, Bf Fw.Leinhard Handwerker, Bs Ogef. Erwin Mutschler . They are all shown as missing in the Luft. QM's returns dated 26th Sept, admendments of report of 8th.Oct. then show the Ff and B as returned wounded and the Bf and Bs as 'gefallen'.
If the burial details of the two dead crewmen are known and are near the crash site it might help indentify whether this loss is a possibility for the aircraft you are looking for.
Thanks but I not think Do217 can came here in Salerno (south Italy) and return to Marseille. Perhaps they came from Foggia. The crash site of this DO217 is on the route that from Salerno go to Foggia....
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  #14  
Old 20th June 2009, 16:05
SALERNO1943 SALERNO1943 is offline
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Re: Dornier 217 crashed in Salerno 16 sept. 1943

Here is other fragments we find in our second trip. Some idea about parts? Thanks.
1

2 Bullet's hole

3

4 Diameter 16 e 18 cm

5

6

6a

7 Magnet 3x3 cm

8 NW 20 ARGUS

9 39.831-0172A CI__ON 3115.4 1384

10 Franz Lange, Berlin

10a 126-621A Fl32958

13 P

14 1577?
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  #15  
Old 9th July 2010, 21:58
SALERNO1943 SALERNO1943 is offline
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Re: Dornier 217 crashed in Salerno 16 sept. 1943

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Bines View Post
Istres is N/W of Marseille. The details of the loss on 13th. Sept are Do217K-2 ZY+MA 4577 of III/KG100 Ff Oblt. Erwin Burghoff, B Uffz. Hans Bastian, Bf Fw.Leinhard Handwerker, Bs Ogef. Erwin Mutschler . They are all shown as missing in the Luft. QM's returns dated 26th Sept, admendments of report of 8th.Oct. then show the Ff and B as returned wounded and the Bf and Bs as 'gefallen'.
If the burial details of the two dead crewmen are known and are near the crash site it might help indentify whether this loss is a possibility for the aircraft you are looking for.
Dear Brian
do you know if Do217 4577 have a BMW engine No: 9 801 832 858 ... We today find a label with this number.
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  #16  
Old 10th July 2010, 08:31
Andy Saunders Andy Saunders is offline
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Re: Dornier 217 crashed in Salerno 16 sept. 1943

The label is prefixed "9" to denote engine parts. The next number, "801", is the engine type - BMW 801. The rest of the numbers appear to just be part numbers/stores reference numbers.

Included in your photo of parts recovered there is what looks like one of the throttle levers. Also, part of one of the elevator mass-balance weights. (This is the curved steel part painted green with part number R8 -217 358. I expect it is quite heavy!)
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  #17  
Old 10th July 2010, 09:06
NoNo01 NoNo01 is offline
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Re: Dornier 217 crashed in Salerno 16 sept. 1943

Hello Gentleman,

maybe a long shot but...
In his book "41 Sekunden bis zum Einschlag" the former III./KG 100 Pilot Klaus Deumling mentions that his Staffelkapitän (7. Staffel) Lt. Michelis was missing since a mission to Salerno and Nettuno on the 16th of September.
The 7./KG 100 flew Do 217 K with Fritz X.
So far so good, but ...
In Ulf Balkes Geschwaderkronik, already mentioned here, we find this loss on the 19th of September.
The same date is mentioned here: http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showth...9.KG100+FOGGIA
But nowhere are details to be found regarding subtype or Werknummer of the flown Do 217.

So what is right and what wrong ??

Herr Deumling wrote his book in 2008 so he hopefully is still alive and well.
You maybe can contact him via the Aviationmuseum "Luftfahrt Museum Hannover-Laatzen".
He frequently worked there voluntarylie.
I think he still has his logbooks and other dokuments.

By the way; what makes You shure it was the 16.09.43 "Your" plane came down ??

Hopefully this gets You a little bit further.

Schoene Gruesze

Norbert
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  #18  
Old 10th July 2010, 11:51
SALERNO1943 SALERNO1943 is offline
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Re: Dornier 217 crashed in Salerno 16 sept. 1943

We are returned to crash site of DO217.
Panoramic view

Gerardo and Daniele. On the back moun Pizzo S. Michele 1565 meters

A welcome meet

We find a lot of fragments (about 80 kg). I'm cleaning them. Now I post these:
Part of engine BMW 801

33570 9-801-300-305.23 N.Z.

Elettric part

2 FL50971-22 3

Label BMW Zeichng. Nr. 9 801 832 858 -- Hersteller: BMW Werk 4 Lfd. Nr. der Hersettelr 2 1 ---

Label BOSCH EM/S 75/75/3 Nennstrom: 75A Prufspannung: 500V= Gerat Nr. 19-8201C-1 Anforderz _____ Werk Nr. 423502

Label BOSCH KM/RC 25/24 ARL4 Syst24V N25W U/min3500 J2,7A BetrlebsartDB Gew1.18kg

Some idea about parts? Thanks.
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  #19  
Old 10th July 2010, 19:35
SALERNO1943 SALERNO1943 is offline
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Re: Dornier 217 crashed in Salerno 16 sept. 1943

Quote:
Originally Posted by NoNo01 View Post
Hello Gentleman,

maybe a long shot but...
In his book "41 Sekunden bis zum Einschlag" the former III./KG 100 Pilot Klaus Deumling mentions that his Staffelkapitän (7. Staffel) Lt. Michelis was missing since a mission to Salerno and Nettuno on the 16th of September.
The 7./KG 100 flew Do 217 K with Fritz X.
So far so good, but ...
In Ulf Balkes Geschwaderkronik, already mentioned here, we find this loss on the 19th of September.
The same date is mentioned here: http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showth...9.KG100+FOGGIA
But nowhere are details to be found regarding subtype or Werknummer of the flown Do 217.

So what is right and what wrong ??

Herr Deumling wrote his book in 2008 so he hopefully is still alive and well.
You maybe can contact him via the Aviationmuseum "Luftfahrt Museum Hannover-Laatzen".
He frequently worked there voluntarylie.
I think he still has his logbooks and other dokuments.

By the way; what makes You shure it was the 16.09.43 "Your" plane came down ??

Hopefully this gets You a little bit further.

Schoene Gruesze

Norbert

Thanks. I'm writing to museum. I'm not sure about date. I simply read it on the book gave us the information about this crash site. It is a 1946 book.
Again thanks.
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  #20  
Old 10th July 2010, 19:38
SALERNO1943 SALERNO1943 is offline
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Re: Dornier 217 crashed in Salerno 16 sept. 1943

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy Saunders View Post
The label is prefixed "9" to denote engine parts. The next number, "801", is the engine type - BMW 801. The rest of the numbers appear to just be part numbers/stores reference numbers.

Included in your photo of parts recovered there is what looks like one of the throttle levers. Also, part of one of the elevator mass-balance weights. (This is the curved steel part painted green with part number R8 -217 358. I expect it is quite heavy!)
Thanks for your precious informations.
Yes, the part you quoted is very heavy and we must take it on from to 1400 meters to valley...... The same happen yesterday: We find about 80 kg of fragments and in 3 take them on to the valley.
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