Ju-88 G-1 Werk Number info needed..

[harrison987]

HI guys,

Curious if anyone has history on the following Ju88 G-1 werk numbers...

710873
713622
711126
712252
714380


Thanks in advance!

Mike

[ArtieBob]

W.Nr.710873 SW+EH. Lost 100% on 31.5.44, crashing at Segeburg from ground fire while operating with Flzg. Überführ.G.1. 3 killed including pilot, Uffz. Gunter Scholze. Source: Tägliche Verlustmeldung Schulen usw.

W.Nr.713622. No data.

W.Nr.711126 DP+QF. Lost 100% on 6.7.44, crashing at Beauvais from an unknown cause while on an operational flight with 5. NJG 4. 3 crew WIA, pilot, Oblt. Ferdinand Christiner, killed. Source: Deutsche Nachtjagd Personalverluste, p.101. (info via Jim P)

W.Nr.712252 TL+MT. Lost 100% on 20.8.44, crashing from pilot error on landing at Fl.Pl.Ingolstadt, while on a flight with NJG 100. Crew OK, pilot, Oblt. Ferdinand Christiner, killed. Source: Deutsch Nachtjagd p.349.


W.Nr.714380 SU+BL. No data.

Best Regards,

ArtieBob

[RT]

Why those numbers ??


Remi

[Roger Gaemperle]

Hi Remi,

Quite probably because in the past weeks many Ju 88 G-1 (and also a few G-6) data plates appeared at ebay.

Strange thing is that according to ArtieBob some of these were 100% losses. I doubt that the data plates were (or even could be) recovered from the wrecks.

Cheers,
Roger

[Rasmussen]

Originally Posted by ArtieBob

W.Nr.711126 DP+QF. Lost 100% on 6.7.44, crashing at Beauvais from an unknown cause while on an operational flight with 5. NJG 4. 3 crew WIA, pilot, Oblt. Ferdinand Christiner, killed. Source: Deutsche Nachtjagd Personalverluste, p.101. (info via Jim P)

W.Nr.712252 TL+MT. Lost 100% on 20.8.44, crashing from pilot error on landing at Fl.Pl.Ingolstadt, while on a flight with NJG 100. Crew OK, pilot, Oblt. Ferdinand Christiner, killed. Source: Deutsch Nachtjagd p.349.

Strange ---- Oblt. Ferdinand Christiner was killed twice!?

Best wishes
Rasmussen

[ArtieBob]

Typo, transfering from spreadsheet to text.

Best Regards,

Artie Bob

[Stig Jarlevik]

Surely Artie, this cannot be your only source

First of all you seem to refer to TWO books by Michael Balss, but the reference to page 101 is not valid for any of them.

None of Balss books states any STKZ

With ref to 712252 Balss states on page 349 WNr 2252 and damage 20%, unit NJG 101 and crew safe (not wounded). No names given. Ingolstad and pilot error is also what Balss lists.

Cheers
Stig

[leonventer]

Originally Posted by ArtieBob

W.Nr.711126 DP+QF. Lost 100% on 6.7.44, crashing at Beauvais from an unknown cause while on an operational flight with 5. NJG 4. 3 crew WIA, pilot, Oblt. Ferdinand Christiner, killed. Source: Deutsche Nachtjagd Personalverluste, p.101. (info via Jim P)

The correct page reference for this entry in Balss' Personalverluste is 309. The pilot, Christiner, was killed and the other 2 crew members, Kath and Zechberger, bailed out wounded.

As Stig said, the Stammkennzeichen Artie listed must have come from another source.

Leon Venter

[stephen f. polyak]

About these Ju 88 plates . . .

Indeed, many, often several at the same time, have appeared on eBay (Germany) over the past few months; in fact, there's one on there now. Most have been marked to the G-1 variant, some to the G-6. All of the plates are the same basic form, marked (acid-etched) with: Gerät-Nr, Werk-Nr and Hersteller:. Corresponding information in the entry boxes was applied (carefully) either by impact stamping or with a rotary machine tool. The Hersteller has consistently been “j.b.q” for Junkers Flugzeug-u. Motorenwerke A.G., Zweigwerk Bernberg. The plates all evidence relatively minor forms of exposure/environmental damage consistent with ground contact and corrosion.

I suspect the plates are authentic, but am not totally 100 percent sure (reproduction plates are in circulation). Seems odd that they would have been removed from dispersed aircraft in various conditions late in the war and then gathered. And why would plates be removed from serviceable aircraft as some, based on W.Nr. records, appear to have been?

Could it be that, for whatever reason, they were never on aircraft? I say that because one other feature is consistent also. None of the plates show any damage to the corner holes where they would have been riveted to the airframe. All holes are uniform, intact; that’s odd, very odd given the number. There does not appear to be any paint overspray on the plates (edges, corners) either, again odd.

For this many equivalent plates (save for W.Nr. entries) to have survived en masse, they were likely bundled. Could these have been (extra) plates that were never used and perhaps buried later (dumped or factory demolition [postwar])? Where did the eBay seller locate them - "bodenfund"?

As an aside, does anyone know what the percentage damage numerics (e.g., 100%) equate to in terms of aircraft physical condition?

[Andreas Brekken]

Hi

Or could the explanation simply be that these plates where prepared for aircraft undergoing repair/reconstruction after an accident, but never used because the end of the war came before the repair work could be finished?

With regards to physical condition... if an aircraft was damaged and assessed to 100% this could mean several things:

1. The aircraft impacted in german controlled area and was totally destroyed, no recoverable parts -> 100% damage

2. The aircraft was reported as missing and could initially not be located and recovered -> 100% damage. If the aircraft was later located and recovered, the 'Halter' or unit operating the aircraft should send in a correction for the initial loss record - this was not always done - and thus one can have a 100% loss that really was 10% or even below that. This could of course also be the result of shifting frontlines!



Regards,
Andreas B