US Strategic Bombing Survey No59 - a questionable statement about 1-seat fighters production

[Dan History]

Originally Posted by Nick Beale

Anyone who wants to air their views on any present-day nation’s ideological shortcomings or the objectivity of perspectives on its history is welcome to do so away from this forum. But while you’re here, please stick to the original topic.

Nick,

Your post is clearly aimed at what I wrote, so it would have helped if you had named me. I respect your sterling work as an unpaid moderator on this forum, but this intervention of yours is not one I can agree with. I do not think, if the Second World War had been taking place as we write on this forum, that you, or anyone else in the free world, would be quite so scrupulous in avoiding any mention of the distorted historical understanding propelling the worldview and policy choices of aggressor nations. There is not another World War yet, for which all of us should be very grateful, but the Russo-Ukrainian and Israel-Hamas wars are far worse than anything that has been seen for many a decade. Russia's war is deeply linked to its interpretation of the past, especially of the Second World War.

On the one hand, it matters very little, perhaps not at all, what modern Russia thinks about anything, including any aspect of Nazi Germany's war effort. On the other hand, it does matter, and a great deal, that people in the West have a sober and accurate understanding of the causes, course and consequences of the Second World War. Within this broader history, the story of the Luftwaffe, including its resource allocation in the final months of the war, is not unimportant. I have addressed several aspects of this subject in my posts above, let me raise another here. Is any information available about the number of aircraft withdrawn from use by the Luftwaffe during 1944, or in any other time-frame? The data in RL 2-III/974 suggests that the following types and sub-types, as a quick assessment, could have been affected by mass withdrawals from service:

Ar 66 on hand in January: 566 on hand in August / September: 302 Difference from January: 264

Bü 131 on hand in January: 882 on hand in August / September: 425 Difference from January: 457

Go 145 on hand in January: 598 on hand in August / September: 316 Difference from January: 282

He 72 on hand in January: 417 on hand in August / September: 229 Difference from January: 188

Ju W 34 on hand in January: 1134 on hand in August / September: 619 Difference from January: 515

Kl 35 on hand in January: 844 on hand in August / September: 492 Difference from January: 352

Bf 109 E on hand in January: 323 on hand in August / September: 62 Difference from January: 261

Bf 110 E on hand in January: 149 on hand in August / September: 98 Difference from January: 51

Ju 86 on hand in January: 362 on hand in August / September: 177 Difference from January: 185


Even the figures for the Fw 200 suggest some retirements to me, although of course losses were considerable in 1944 for this rare aircraft type. I suppose Chris Goss might be able to crack the numbers and express an opinion:

Fw 200 on hand in January: 80 on hand in August / September: 48 Difference from January: 32


I won’t be able to take the discussion further here, unfortunately, because I have plenty of urgent tasks to be getting on with, but I would be glad if others here analysed RL 2-III/974 and the other files mentioned above, and gave their opinion.

Happy New Year, Nick!

[Dmitry Volodin]

Originally Posted by edwest2

Perhaps the following book will shed additional light on the air war in the East. It will be out in a month or two depending on your location.

https://www.casematepublishers.com/9...alins-falcons/

Usual disclaimer,
Ed

Description sounds like same propaganda but now in opposite direction. Air war wasn't so simple like black-white picture.

[edwest2]

It all depends on the documents. There are other books covering the Eastern air war.

[Andrey Kuznetsov]

Of course, Mr. Kuznetsov will not acknowledge that the Luftwaffe flew more sorties in the East than elsewhere in 1944-45 because it was largely suppressed by Allied air power in the West and Mediterranean. This general pattern was established significantly earlier than 1944, of course

In the first two years, the Luftwaffe was not suppressed in the West, and did most of the sorties in the East. The next two years, the Luftwaffe was suppressed in the West, and again most of the sorties were in the East. OK

In order not to litter this thread with messages unrelated to USSBS-59, I opened a new thread about combat sorties ratio West:East. It is an interesting question that requires research and reflection.
http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showthread.php?t=64501

We all know why the Luftwaffe stopped almost all daylight bomber sorties over Britain in 1940.

This does credit to the British Air Defense and to Fighter Command.
But in the Mediterranean the bombers and Ju87 continued daylight combat sorties at least until November 1943.

I don't want to continue the unprovoked offtop. The only thing I wonder is where Mr.DanHistory found examples of my "bilious hatred of the West and Ukraine."

[Nick Beale]

I don’t want this thread getting ugly again. The same rules still apply: any members who want to conduct a personal fight, take it off-board.

Stick to the topic, both here and in Andrey’s new thread on East:West sortie ratios, and we’ll get along fine.