B-24 forced down intact in Italy

[Jochen Prien]

Gentlemen,

this issue may have been discussed before here or on the old LEMB forum; however, since I cannot find it anywhere I would like to ask the following question: On 12 July 1944 German - or Italian ? - fighters forced an allied aircraft, allegedly an undamaged B-24, to land at an airfield in Northern Italy. A note from a former pilot of I./JG77 claims that it was his Gruppe which was repsonsible for this feat, stating that it was a B-24. Can anybody enlighten me as to the whereabouts of this incident ? Was it really a B-24 and if so - which unit, serial no. etc. Any further information aailable on this incedent - unit involved, where did it land etc. Any help would be gratefully appreciated.

KR

Jochen Prien

[Nick Beale]

This is what we wrote in Air War Italy 1944–45:

Uffz. Ewald Schummer of 5./JG 77 achieved something more solid by forcing down an intact B-24. Hit by Flak on an 8th AF mission to Munich, it was making for Allied-occupied Italy with a dead crewman aboard. II./JG 77 was assembling over Ghedi for an operation when Schummer spotted the Liberator whose pilot, recognising his hopeless position, was persuaded to land. The bomber was parked in one of the big blast pens of Ghedi's southeastern dispersal area but MAAF soon knew its whereabouts.

Having written that around 30 years ago, I can't now remember the sources for it, unfortunately. It's somewhere in my mass of handwritten notes, I suppose — if I can find anything, I'll let you know.

[Frank Olynyk]

Jochen,

The only 15th AF B-24 losses on this date were on a mission to Nimes, France, so I doubt that any came down in northern Italy. I do not see any B-24 force landing in Italy for July 12 in Bishop & Hay Losses of the US 8th and 9th Air Forces, Vol. 4, Jul--Sept 1944.


I think I found it in the above book, for July 12; page 70. B-24J-145-CO 44-40130 X4-Q+ 492nd BG, 859th BS. MACR 7563. Pilot Capt. Herschel L Smith. RWG died in a fire in the waist. Pilot attempted to reach Switzerland, but crash landed on Ghedi/Brescia A/F. 1 KIA, 10 POW.

Enjoy!

Frank.

[Horst Weber]

Originally Posted by Nick Beale

This is what we wrote in Air War Italy 1944–45:

Uffz. Ewald Schummer of 5./JG 77 achieved something more solid by forcing down an intact B-24. Hit by Flak on an 8th AF mission to Munich, it was making for Allied-occupied Italy with a dead crewman aboard. II./JG 77 was assembling over Ghedi for an operation when Schummer spotted the Liberator whose pilot, recognising his hopeless position, was persuaded to land. The bomber was parked in one of the big blast pens of Ghedi's southeastern dispersal area but MAAF soon knew its whereabouts.

Having written that around 30 years ago, I can't now remember the sources for it, unfortunately. It's somewhere in my mass of handwritten notes, I suppose — if I can find anything, I'll let you know.

Good evening

This looks like B-24, AAF s/n 44-40130, 492nd BG, 859th BS. The German sources are KU 2480 and AV 1193/44. The latter states 16:00 hrs as time of the incident.

Hope this helps

Horst Weber

[Nick Beale]

I just checked the MACR which confirms eveything Horst has said. The aircraft was already damaged by Flak and the fighters forced it to land at 1600 hours (see attached extract).

[Rottler]

The German casualty no. was KU 2465, not KU 2480.

Regards
Leo

[RSwank]

The B-24 was destroyed two days later by P-38s from the 82nd FG. See page 17 of this:

http://451st.org/Ad%20Lib/Pdfs/Issue%2026.pdf

[Jochen Prien]

Many thanks to all of you for your help. In the photo I have there is no visible damage to the a/c which apparently has made a perfect wheels down landing.

KR

Jochen Prien

[Horst Weber]

Originally Posted by Rottler

The German casualty no. was KU 2465, not KU 2480.

Regards
Leo

Thank you for the correction. Unfortunately, I looked one line deeper.

Best wishes !.

Horst Weber

[Horst Weber]

Originally Posted by Jochen Prien

Many thanks to all of you for your help. In the photo I have there is no visible damage to the a/c which apparently has made a perfect wheels down landing.

KR

Jochen Prien

Good afternoon !

There is a good explanation of the incident in the 492nd BG's homepage.
An 88mm Flak shell penetrated the ball-turret and killed the BTG. The shell landed unexploded in the a/c's floor. After this (and probably other incidents), the pilot decided, to make it to Swizerland.

Horst Weber