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Old 14th August 2019, 13:43
Andy Fletcher's Avatar
Andy Fletcher Andy Fletcher is offline
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I./JG 1 on 18 Mar 43

Can anyone tell me if it was only the 2nd staffel of I./JG 1 that engaged American bombers on 18 Mar 43 or did 1./JG 1 and 3./JG 1 also fly. JG 1 volume II, by Eric Mombeeck, only mentions 2./JG 1 but I wondered if later works add any additional detail.

Also was the B-24 claim by Lt Dieter Gerhardt (2./JG 1) on this day confirmed as he was KIA in on the same sortie.

Best Regards

Andy Fletcher
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Old 14th August 2019, 21:47
Rottler Rottler is offline
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Re: I./JG 1 on 18 Mar 43

Hello Andy,

according to JFV 10/II all three Staffeln of I./JG 1 were engaged. The 1./JG 1 lost Oblt Schmude near Heligoland (Bf 109 G-1/R2 WNr. 14 145).
The claim of Lt Gerhardt was not confirmed.

Regards
Leo
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Old 15th August 2019, 03:54
Nick Hector Nick Hector is offline
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Re: I./JG 1 on 18 Mar 43

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy Fletcher View Post
Can anyone tell me if it was only the 2nd staffel of I./JG 1 that engaged American bombers on 18 Mar 43 or did 1./JG 1 and 3./JG 1 also fly. JG 1 volume II, by Eric Mombeeck, only mentions 2./JG 1 but I wondered if later works add any additional detail.

Also was the B-24 claim by Lt Dieter Gerhardt (2./JG 1) on this day confirmed as he was KIA in on the same sortie.

Best Regards

Andy Fletcher
Hi Andy,

On my database, I have Gerhard's victim listed as:

Possibly "Eager Beaver" of 93rd BG, seen to drop out of formation but made it back to UK. Pilot was Frank Lown

Frey and Knoke also claimed, their victims listed as follows:

330th BS, 93rd BG. 1 loss: 41-23666 "Hot Freight". Lt. Howard E "Tarzan" Kleinstuber and 7 crewmen KIA. 1 man POW. Attributed by US sources to Bf110s, with 10 men KIA and 1 POW by Joe Baugher's serials website. One other B-24 lost, not positively identified. Plus one "Viermot" lost to flak. Boiten and Bowman definitely attribute "Hot Freight" to Knoke. Also damaged was "Shoot Luke" of George Murphy which accompanied "Eager Beaver" back to UK

Regards,

Nick
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Old 15th August 2019, 10:30
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Andy Fletcher Andy Fletcher is offline
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Re: I./JG 1 on 18 Mar 43

Hi Leo,

Thank you for looking up the information for me, very much appreciated.

Nick,

Thank you for the additional information.

Best Regards

Andy Fletcher
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Old 15th August 2019, 10:38
Stig Jarlevik Stig Jarlevik is offline
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Re: I./JG 1 on 18 Mar 43

Thanks Nick

Just out of curiosity, the "other B-24 lost" (not positively identified), from where comes this information?

It is not listed by Roger Freeman in his Mighty Eighth volume and not in Bishop/Hay's book either.

Since it seems all units this day had a single target (Vegesack) could it be some confusion with the B-17s lost/salvaged?

I take it you already have the s/n for both Eager Beaver and Shoot Luke. If not I will send them over in a jiffy (I like the word jiffy, being a Hardy /Laurel fan, so I use it whenever I can.... )

Cheers
Stig
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Old 15th August 2019, 12:35
Rottler Rottler is offline
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Re: I./JG 1 on 18 Mar 43

Hello,

in JFV 10/II the claim list of I./JG 1 includes three entries for the 2./JG 1 on 18 March 1943:
Lt Heinz Knoke B-24 (2.) 15.14 10 km southeast of Helgoland confirmed
Oblt Hugo Frey B-24 (6.) 15.18 north of Wangerooge confirmed
Lt Dieter Gerhardt B-24 15.37 area Heligoland not confirmed.
In JFV 10/I is noted (footnote 127 on page 48):
"Der Abschuss von Lt Gerhardt ist nur in den Aufzeichnungen von Heinz Knoke erwähnt; er erscheint weder in den Unterlagen des XII. Fl.-Korps noch in den Abschusslisten des RLM, dürfte also nicht zur Anerkennung eingereicht worden sein" = the claim for Lt Gerhardt was obviously not submitted for confirmaton.

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Leo
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