325th FG vs Ju-52

[focusfocus]

30/01/44: Villaorba/Udine

11 Ju-52 claimed shot down (including 4 by Herschell Green and 3 by Cecil O.Dean).
How much in reality and what unit?
michel

[Matti Salonen]

5 from 5./TG 2 (WNr. 3233 8T+CP, 4046 8T+DP, 6650 8T+HN, 7268 8T+CN and 10148 8T+BP).

Matti

[focusfocus]

thank you!

Matti,a subsidiary question:Herschell Green also claimed a Do-217....really? or rather one Bf.110?.... German Cant Z.1007?(they were present in the north )
michel

[Nick Beale]

A Do 217 is possible but unlikely. III./KG 100 did make use of Northern Italian airfields during operations against Anzio-Nettuno but Jean-Louis Roba's book records no loss on 30 January.

Here are some ULTRA messages from January 1944 that may be relevant:

(VL 5179) Orders of 30th: I./KG 76 to Villaorba, arrival expected 30th. Unspecified elements of KG 30 to Bergamo. Three of II. and one of Stab/KG 100 arrived Bergamo from Istres, midday/30th.

(serial no. ?) Orders of 30th: I./KG 76 to Villaorba, arrival expected 30th. Unspecified elements of KG 30 to Bergamo. Three of II. and one of Stab/KG 100 arrived Bergamo from Istres, midday/30th.

(VL5210) Substitute for VL 5179: I./KG 76 being sent by C-in-C GAF to Villaorba with key personnel. Arrival expected 30th (comment: last located north Germany). KG 30 (comment: not known how much) transferring to Bergamo according to KG 76 on 20th. Three of II. and one of Stab/KG 100 arrived Bergamo-South midday/30th.

(VL 5221) In raids on Villaorba at 10.45 and 11.20 by B-17s and B-24s numerous aircraft damaged by splinters.

(VL 5285) Following left Villaorba for Bergamo–South (compare Vl 5210): 12 Ju 88 of KG 30 (being six of I. Gruppe and six of II. Gruppe) 23.30/30–10.00/31.

[Chris Goss]

I have no Do 217s lost 30 Jan 44

[Matti Salonen]

I have only this:
1944-01-30, 2./LG 1, Ju 88 A-4, 3892, L1+GL, Terco, 30 km südlich Udine
Flugzeugführer Uffz Bogner, Franz, +
Kampfbeobachter Obgfr Dunga, Werner, +
Bordfunker Fw Dörr, Jacob, +
1.Wart Uffz Eulenberg, Albert, +
Prüfmstr Zimmermann, Walter, +
Jägerbeschuß. Bruch 100 %.

No Do 217, Bf 110 or Cant Z.1007.

Matti

[Stig Jarlevik]

I take if that Prüfmstr stands for Prüfmeister?

What was his job on this flight? I suppose he was some kind of inspector/controller of something, but it feels odd to have him onboard a flight so close to the battlefront. Did every unit have one or more like him?
Was he actually a pilot or did he check out on other things?

Cheers
Stig

[Nick Beale]

Originally Posted by Stig Jarlevik

I take if that Prüfmstr stands for Prüfmeister?

What was his job on this flight? I suppose he was some kind of inspector/controller of something, but it feels odd to have him onboard a flight so close to the battlefront. Did every unit have one or more like him?
Was he actually a pilot or did he check out on other things?

Cheers
Stig

Villaorba is about 475 km from Anzio-Nettuno, so not really "close to the battlefront".

[Brian Bines]

The LG 1 book says this was a Prüfflug which I believe was a test flight and it fell to long range fighters crashing north of Grado . I thought a Prüfmeister was a kind if civil servant allowed to wear service uniform with a rank from Fw to Major , similar status to the weather inspectors .

[Stig Jarlevik]

Good point Nick

But still close enough to get shot down.
What did he do that an ordinary crew could not accomplish?
Was it usual or unusual to have such an individual within a combat unit?

Cheers
Stig