Question about the markings on the Bf109F-1 of Werner Mölders during the last quarter of 1940

[Clint Mitchell]

The Golden question:

Originally Posted by Rob Romero

How can one tell an F-1 from an F-2?

...

Did all F-1s have the Emil style wing roots?

[Leo Etgen]

Hello guys

Lynn Ritger in The Messerschmitt Bf 109 Part 2 states that the differences between the F-1 and F-2 consisted of:

• MG/FF instead of MG 151/20
• Wing root fillets attached with a riveted strip such as the Emil
• Wingtip navigation lights covered by a small colored glass shield over the bulbs rather than a clear conformal Plexiglas cover (again, similar to the Emil)
• Port exhausts lack exhaust deflection shield

Unfortunately, some of these characteristics can be found on early production F-2 fighters, particularly those built by WNF in the 6651 through 6822 block. Therefore, the only ironclad way of identifying a F-1 is by the werknummer, a cockpit photograph showing the MG/FF enclosed by a zippered canvas cover or the riveted wing root fillet fitted to only the earliest aircraft.

Here are a pair of very poor quality photographs that I have been able to find of the fighter flown by Mölders in the time period that is being discussed. The first shows the rudder marked with 54 victories and the Stammkennzeichen partially painted over. Note that this rudder had roundels and victory date information painted on and the photograph was possibly taken in November 1940 as the JG 51 book by Stipdonk and Meyer includes a close up of this rudder with the identical number of victory markings that according to the caption was taken that month. The second photograph was purportedly taken on 12 March 1941 and shows the aircraft with 61 victories marked on the rudder according to the caption in the JG 51 book by Weal. Note that the JG 51 Falcon/Buzzard badge has not been painted on as according to Weal this appeared in mid-April 1941. My apologies for the very poor quality of the photographs.

Horrido!

Leo

[Clint Mitchell]

Thank you Leo for your precisions.

[Stig Jarlevik]

Clint

A bit late, but no the photos in the Mölders book just shows the extreme tail unit and nothing else.

Cheers
Stig

[Clint Mitchell]

Thank you

[Larry Hickey]

Hello,

Just to summarize here, I don't think that we've determined here that there are any photos that confirm that the Mölders Bf109F-1 carried a full set of Gesch Kde markings at any time in 1940. Is that still where we are, or did I miss something?

Regards,

Larry Hickey
EoE Project Coordinator

[F19Gladiator]

Hi Larry,
That is eaxactly where we stand for the moment at LEMB as well:
http://www.luftwaffe-experten.org/fo...topic=16599&hl=
Br
Goran

[Oberst]

49th, 50th, & 51st victories by october 22, 1940. So it MAY be possible that the foto I posted (Me-109F-4) could have been taken in last months of 1940. I take another look at rudder, victories could be anywhere from 45-60 (not clear enough).

Stig, can you post your foto to know for sure, thanks.

[Stig Jarlevik]

Oberst

Sorry I don't have any photos myself, I looked in a book about Mölders.
However I differ from your opinion especially if you are talking about an F-4, they were not in production in 1940 and your photo is then completely impossible in 1940.

I doubt Mölders got anything else than a F-1 in late 1940. I also believe the aircraft which he scored his 54th victory in was an E-model.

To me it looks like he flew in late 1940 in a sloppily overpainted F-1 and while he is on a winter holiday it gets painted in his traditional Geschwader marking sometime in 1941.

Cheers
Stig

[Leo Etgen]

Hi guys

Lynn Ritger in The Messerschmitt Bf 109 Part 2 writes that the first production Bf 109 F-1 (W.Nr. 5628) was sent to Mölders for service testing at the beginning of October 1940. His first victories with it were claimed on 22 October (49-51) and 25 October (52-53) according to this source. In the JG 51 book by Stipdonk and Meyer there is a photograph of his fighter which was taken on 15 April 1941 and shows the rudder marked with 63 victories including roundels according to the caption. In the JG 51 book by Weal there is a photograph of the rudder of his fighter taken on 16 April 1941 according to the caption and which is marked with 65 victory bars including roundels and victory date information. In summery, the latest photograph of 1940 (possibly November 1940) shows the Stammkennzeichen partially painted over and 54 victories and the earliest of 1941 (12 March 1941) shows the Geschwaderkommodore markings applied and 61 victories. I agree that the photograph that Oberst posted is from 1941, possibly later than mid-April as the Geschwader emblem has been added.

Horrido!

Leo