Question about the markings on the Bf109F-1 of Werner Mölders during the last quarter of 1940

[Oberst]

Thanks Leo, you are a cornicopia of information!

[Stig Jarlevik]

Thanks Leo

The problem I, at least seems to have, is that I can't count the victories on the tail of the overpainted aircraft you refer to. But from what I at least think I can see the victory bars are painted different than those in the Mölders book I refer to. Both the photo of 51 bars and 54 bars are of the same aircraft and has roundels over each claim. Between each roundel and bar there are something which is not readable, but presumably dates. I can accept that they are from an F-1 and not an E model, but the photo you refer to seems to me to lack these roundels, which was why I assumed the Mölders book showed E-type rudders....
Silly puzzle....

But it changes nothing to the main question Larry had and where it looks like we all agree by now!

Cheers
Stig

[KrisJG3]

See super film:

Location: Germany
Date: 1940

"'...Street sign refers to public transport connection to Germany that runs daily until the end of the war. A dirt airfield. Ground crews load belt ammunition into boxes near Bf-109 (Me-109) aircraft on which mechanics are working. Ground crew refuels an aircraft. Famous German fighter pilot ace, Werner Molders, is assisted as he changes into flight clothes and climbs into the cockpit of his Bf-109 airplane. (Tail of his airplane shows 42 painted marks, representing aerial victories.) Crew chief stands on wing and cranks engine. Molders taxis out and takes off. Formation of Bf-109s in flight and over coastal waters. View from cockpit as German plane dives to attack allied ship in water. ...''

By the way on the view One of Werk Nr.: 3638

Source:

http://www.criticalpast.com/video/65...itish-Spitfire

[Larry Hickey]

KrisJG3,

I don't remember seeing this video source before or this film, although individual frames from it are known to me. This includes a photo of Mölders WNr. 5915, a W.Nr. that I'd not previously associated with his a/c. It shows 42 victories which would date this at the end of Sept., or the first 10 days of Oct., 1940. These have to be around late Sept., 1940. Excellent reference source. He's apparently flying a mission with JG53, as there are a/c from III./JG3 and I./JG3 on the film, as well as a Bf110 of 8./ZG26.

Are there other films that you've looked at on this site that have similar 1939-40 Luft a/c images?

Has anyone else seem images of Mölders flying W.Nr. 5915? This must have been between his E's #2804 and 3737, and was possibly his spare a/c during this period?

Regards,

Larry Hickey
EoE Project Coordinator

[KrisJG3]

Hi Larry,

I have found only this film, sorry nothing more .

Kris

[Clint Mitchell]

A bit more on this Bf109 from Jim P. Originally sourced from TOCH but appears on LWAG

"Jim P.
Re: Bf109E W.Nr5915 Pilot I.D.
Sun May 11 18:02:19 2003
67.242.219.82

Bf 109E-4 5915 MÖLDERS, Major Werner 115 Stab JG 51 42 vic: 12, 16, 14 schwarz balken date: between 28.Sept.-11.Oct 1940 RK,EL,S,Br Kanal foto Jagdglieger Oberst Werner Mölder p.111, 116 - F
Bf 109E-7 5915 Erg.JGr.West 11-Jun-42 Bruchlandung due to pilot error. FR Gen.Qu.6.Abt. (mfm #6)-Vol. 9 Fl.Pl. Cazaux 25% H
Bf 109E-7 5915 II. JG 51 31-May-41 Fehlstart. Kanal Gen.Qu.6.Abt. (mfm #3)-Vol.5; Prien, et al, Die Jagdfliegerverbände, IV.2, p.70; Foreman, 1941-The Turning Point, II, p.267 Fl.Pl. Mardyck/Dünkirchen 40% H"

[steve sheridan]

Hi, just to add to the film KrisJG3 posted showing the tail of Bf110E 3U+FS W.Nr 3638. This a/c must have been later handed over to I/ZG26, as it was lost in the Balkans 26.4.41 as U8+AL flown by Uffz Wilhelm Rodel of 3/ZG26.

Best regs,
Steve.

[Larry Hickey]

Clint & Steve,

Thanx for the further info on these two images. Will be adding these photos to the EoE Photo DB after ordering them from the Critical Past website. Has anyone else perused this website for a/c images from the 1939-40 period that might support the EoE Project efforts? It looks like there might be a lot of useful material from both British and German wartime newsreel footage from this source. I'm not going to have a lot of time to scan through these looking for images, but if someone else is going to do this anyway, I'd appreciate any references to potentially useful photos. Looks like a real gold mine of info.

Regards,

Larry Hickey
EoE Project Coordinator

[ChrisS]

Does anybody know what Bf-109E variant he flew with JG53 and the WNr. I know he crashed one but did he fly more than one?

Thanks

Chris

[Leo Etgen]

Hello Chris

I know that on 8 September 1939 he was injured when his fighter somersaulted while crash-landing near Wolfersweiler due to engine trouble. Then on 5 June 1940 he was shot down in aerial combat and baled out of his Bf 109 E-3 near Canly to be taken prisoner. It is generally assumed that his victor was Sous Lieutenant René Layragues (6 victories, killed in action 5 June 1940) of GC II/7, Armée de l'Air but it may very well be that he was shot down in error by another German fighter. Unfortunately, I know nothing about the werknummer of either aircraft since at that period such information was usually not included in the loss lists.

Horrido!

Leo