Friendly fire WWII

[Six Nifty .50s]

Originally Posted by Leendert

Brian,

A post by me on rafcommands.com has so far been unanswered, but on 7 Oct 1944 Mosquito MM512 of RCAF 409 Squadron is said to have been shot down by Allied AA fire in the Ostend, Belgium area. (see e.g. Shores & Thomas, 2 TAF, Vol. 2).
Crew P/O Norman Joss and P/O Peter Lailey commemorated at Runnymede.

No further details to either confirm or deny above incident?

Regards,

Leendert

Does Hugh Halliday or Larry Milberry post messages over there? If it's about the RCAF they might know more or direct you to someone else.

[Disbos]

Hello, from Six Nifty .50s post on the previous page there is the followng item:-

22 May 1940
Blenheim L9266 (59 Squadron). Shot down by RAF Spitfire and crashed near Fricourt, France. Three crewmen killed. (p.226). Warner, Graham. Bristol Blenheim: A Complete History. 2nd Edition.

Having a house just down the road I have a particular interest in this crash. I was aware that there is no corresponding German fighter claim but the concept of friendly fire is new to me. Does anyone know anything more on this?

Best regards, David D

[B.F.M. Droog]

Hello Brian,

Regarding 'aircraft collisions with (own) barrage balloons':

1. Hampden P1336, 106 Sqdn., 24/05/1940: cross-country flight, UK
Collided with a balloon cable in Coventry. 3 KIA

I don't know of this accident can be linked with:
Aircraftman 1st Class Cyril G. Shepperd, RAF 340015, 911 Balloon, age unknown, 24/05/1940, Sheffield (Burngreave) Cemetery, UK

2. Hampden P1340, KM-?, 44 Sqdn.,03-04/06/1940: Emmerich, Germany
Crashed into the River Orwell near Harwich, Essex, after colliding with a barrage balloon cable. 2 MIA

3. Whitley P5044, 77 Sqdn - collided with Balloon cables early one morning 15th August 1940 at about 3.30 am to 3.34 am (03.30 hrs RAF - 03.34 hrs A.A. Intell. Reports and Observer Posts reported time). See http://www.bbc.co.uk/ww2peopleswar/u.../u933805.shtml

4. Something completely else: I didn't see any references to RAF and USAAF bombings by mistake of cities (Nijmegen, Enschede, Den Haag (The Hague)). Do you need information on those bombings?

Regards,

Bart
--------
RAF Losses 10/05/1940-30/06/1940

[Brian]

Hi Bart

Thanks - yes, I am recording such incidents and do have those you list. However, I would be grateful for whatever you have regarding bombing 'errors' and suchlike.

Many thanks in advance
Brian

[RodM]

Hi Brian,

'just in case you haven't seen it; beginning on page 82 of RAFHS Journal No. 34, W/C Geoff Jefford provides an overview of 20th Century Fratricide incidents with particular emphasis on the RAF. Included at the end of the presentation are (by no means exhaustive) tables that identify RAF aircraft involved in various incidents during WWII - air-to-air, ground-to-air, ground-to-air (barrage balloons), air-to-ground (by heavy bombing), US ship fratricide casualties.

This Journal (and others) is available for download in PDF format at the RAFM website: http://www.rafmuseum.org.uk/london/r...h/journals.cfm


Cheers

Rod

[Brian]

Thanks a million, Rod, I hadn't seen that article - most interesting. I do however have most of the incidents shown, but a few are new to me. Great stuff! One I didn't know about was the British Airways Oxford hitting a balloon cable in November 1939. Am endeavouring to obtain some details.

Thanks again

PS: I note you are in NZ - pity your cricket team is about to get turned over by England!

Brian

[RodM]

Originally Posted by Brian

PS: I note you are in NZ - pity your cricket team is about to get turned over by England!

Brian

Hi Brian,

LOL, fully with the benefit of hindsight, yes, it was a pity!

'wonder what the headlines in the English weekend papers will be...

Cheers

Rod

[B.F.M. Droog]

Hello Brian,

As promised some info on Allied bombings on Dutch cities:

Nijmegen (near the border with Germany)

In an air attack on 22/02/1944 (ca. 13.30 hrs local time) by the 8th Air Force - supposed to hit a German town - at least 771 Dutch civilians lost their lives. A bilangual victims list (Dutch/English can be found on the site www.noviomagus.nl

Enschede (near the border with Germany)

In heavy allied air attacks on 10/10/1943, 22/02/1944 and 22/03/1945 the inner city of Enschede was heavily damaged. More than 250 civilians lost their lives. (source: Overijssel Province - history of Enschede)

Enschede was an important industrial town and industrial buildings were throughout the war attacked on purpose - but at least two of these bombardments (the last two) were a mistake; the bombs were supposed to hit a target in Germany.

Further Dutch cities attacked on the 22/02/1944 were Arnhem and Deventer.

The book 'De fatale aanval' (the fatal attack) by Alfons E. Brinkuis can be read on the site of Nijmegen City. It's in Dutch, but with a wee bit of effort even Englishmen should be able to distill the American units responsible for these attacks out of it.

I'll report later on an air attack on The Hague.

Regards,

Bart

[B.F.M. Droog]

This is I guess the page were the interesting part starts.

[B.F.M. Droog]

A summary of 'The fatal attack'

2nd Division of 8th Air Force was to attack as primary target Gotha (Gothaer Waggon Fabrik AG - Me 110 assembly line; GY 4765 A, Mean Point of Impact: 029942/5. Secondary target factories and airfield near Eschwege, Germany.

Outward bound the 74 B24's of 2nd Division 8th Air Force (of the 252 bombers originally planned to be involved in this attack!) are recalled. The formation breaks up, as crews decide to attack targets of 'opportunity', thinking they're already above Germany.

on this page you can find thumbnails of all pages of the mentioned book, with many photos and maps.