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Japanese and Allied Air Forces in the Far East Please use this forum to discuss the Air War in the Far East. |
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#1
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VF 2 claims :battle of Coal Sea
Hello
On what date (7 or 8 ) and what type (Zero,Kate,Val) their claims? Paul Ramsey=3 or 4? Edward Sellstrom=3 Albert Vorse=2 John Bain=1 Willard Eder=1 Robert Morgan=1 Best Regards Michel |
#2
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Re: VF 2 claims :battle of Coal Sea
According to Lundstrom's "First Team":
All on May 8, apart from 2 Zekes by Ramsey on the 7th. The others, May 8, were, Vorse: 1 Val 1 Zeke Bain: 1 Zeke Eder: 1 Zeke Morgan: 1 Zeke Sellstrom: 1 Kate, 2 Zekes Ramsey: 1 Zeke
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George Kernahan |
#3
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Re: VF 2 claims :battle of Coal Sea
Thank you
However,I have a recent source(Claringbould/Ingman) and according to them,Ramsey claimed 3 Zeke (in reality Kate of Zuikaku) on 7/5/42 around 5.30pm/6.00pm. 5 Kate of Zuikaku (claimed as Zeke) were shot down by VF 2 on 7/5/42 Paul Baker(1),William Wileman(1) and so Paul Ramsey(2 or 3 ?)....if it's only 2 by Ramsey,who claimed the last? Michel |
#4
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Re: VF 2 claims :battle of Coal Sea
According to Lundstrom, although the VF2 pilots on dusk CAP thought that their targets were Zekes, they were in fact B5N Kates.
Ramsey shot down 2, Baker 1 and Wileman1. The fifth was an aircraft under attack by Baker, which was seen to explode. He may have been caught in the blast, as he failed to return. Possibly he shot it down, or he may have collided with it. Ramsey and Wileman also claimed 1 probable each.
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George Kernahan |
#5
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Re: VF 2 claims :battle of Coal Sea
Michel
As per our late friend Frank Olynyk Lt Cdr Paul Hubert Ramsey made three claims on the 7th (at 1800H) Two Type 00 VF as confirmed One Type 00 VF as a probable The same Ramsey also made two claims on the 8th (at 1113-1145H) One Me-109 confirmed (Ens George Markham was involved but withdrew his claim) One Me-109 as a probable B Rgds Stig PS: Sorry George, you were faster than me.... Yes, what you say is also in Frank's lists |
#6
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Re: VF 2 claims :battle of Coal Sea
No bother, Stig---I'm sure that you know a lot more about air-to-air claims than me.
However, I took a look at VF-2's report for the 7th and this is what it said about Baker: "It is believed that Baker collided with an enemy Zero fighter during retirement from his attack and both crashed in flames on the water".
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George Kernahan |
#7
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Re: VF 2 claims :battle of Coal Sea
Quote:
I suppose have a certain interest in claims vs losses..... Interestingly Frank does mention one claim by Baker in the evening fight, but reading Lundstrom page 211 it does not seem to be the aircraft he later is supposed to have collided with. At least Frank never gave Baker a second claim (victory) that day, as implied by Lundstrom. I know too little about how the USN awarded victories in 1942 to know if this is a "glitch" in the system, or if collisions did not work as a final claim.... Perhaps the evidence was considered to be too vague since not even Lundstrom gives Baker a final second victory that day in his summary on page 218 Cheers Stig |
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