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Allied and Soviet Air Forces Please use this forum to discuss the Air Forces of the Western Allies and the Soviet Union.

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  #11  
Old 1st September 2022, 11:53
Adriano Baumgartner Adriano Baumgartner is offline
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Re: Info needed on RAF WW2 acccidents resulting from human blame

Volume 3

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Clipped-Win...s=books&sr=1-9
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  #12  
Old 1st September 2022, 12:05
Stig Jarlevik Stig Jarlevik is online now
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Re: Info needed on RAF WW2 acccidents resulting from human blame

Hi Adriano

Colin has, so far, published eight volumes, including the ones you have located.

Since the request/topic was WW 2 I should "disallow" his four post-war books, even if one of them deals
with 1945, but after VE day.

Beside his Clipped Wings (three volumes known and I hope the fourth will come along shortly), he has
also done 'Though Without Anger' dealing with losses of Transport and Special Duties aircraft and Assault
Gliders 1940-45.

Cheers
Stig

PS: He has actually published a few more but when they came out in a new version, they were brought together
in one single volume. The above eight I mention don't duplicate anything between them
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  #13  
Old 2nd September 2022, 21:05
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Bruce Lander Bruce Lander is offline
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Re: Info needed on RAF WW2 acccidents resulting from human blame

Wing Commander E V Knowles, Flying Officer A B Paton, Major G K Wait, Mrs T Oliver: killed; Leading Aircraftman A Henderson: died of injuries, Corporal T P Butler, Aircraftman F Williams, Aircraftman C A Salt: uninjured; Whitley BD417 296 Squadron, aircraft accident, RAF Andreas, Isle of Man, 23 August 1942.

23 Aug 42 Aircraft: Whitley V BD417 Unit 296 Sqdn Airfield /Crash Location , Isle of Man

An issue of 609 Squadron Association booklet tells how W/Cdr Knowles th OC Andreas enjoyed flying every different aircraft that landed on the airfield in transit and on this day he commandeered the Whitley and took the visitors in the Mess on an impromptu flight after a liquid lunch, sadly he decided to try a loop with tragic results and several on board were killed.
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  #14  
Old 2nd September 2022, 21:09
edwest2 edwest2 is offline
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Re: Info needed on RAF WW2 acccidents resulting from human blame

Stig,

"self inflicted"? Really? I doubt that my goal when going up would be to crash into another plane or the ground. I think another term should be used.

Best,
Ed
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  #15  
Old 2nd September 2022, 23:22
Stig Jarlevik Stig Jarlevik is online now
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Re: Info needed on RAF WW2 acccidents resulting from human blame

Ed

I hope you understand the difference between "self inflicted" vs self inflicted.....
If not, feel free to use whatever word you feel fits

Stig
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  #16  
Old 15th September 2022, 17:42
Laurent Rizzotti Laurent Rizzotti is offline
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Re: Info needed on RAF WW2 acccidents resulting from human blame

Quote:
Originally Posted by MW Giles View Post
Reading the F1180 accident record card, you get the impression that the powers that be were very ready to blame the pilots and crew

I have never seen them ask the question, what were the root causes of that failure - lack of information, instruction, training, supervision, workload, command expectations etc.

It is easy to blame the crew, harder to blame yourself for putting him there in the first place

Martin
Charles Demoulin, a Belgian Typhoon pilot, has in his book (Firebird in English if I am not confused) a story about a young pilot joining his squadron who he thinks was not "ready". He hesitated to reject him, finally agreed to have him fly a test flight... and saw him crash and burn to death at the end of the runway. He really blamed himself. By the way I read it decades ago and lost the book before starting my real interest in the air war, so I have no idea who the poor guy was and when it occured.

Not related to RAF, but I read a lot of Armée de l'Air (French airforce) accidents reports for the WWII years, and in most of them the idea is to put the blame to who he belongs, and having an inexperienced pilot doing more than he could would draw blame for his commander, or having a pilot being ordered to fly despite excepted very bad weather would draw blame either on the commander having given the order or the meteorological officer, depending if the latter did his work correctly or not.
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Old 16th September 2022, 14:50
Boomerang Boomerang is offline
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Re: Info needed on RAF WW2 acccidents resulting from human blame

Hello Danny:

You mention "RAF - Commonwealth", so I assume Royal Australian Air Force (RAAF) accidents would interest you.

If that is the case, you may find relevant examples in the RAAF's World War Two Accident files for different aircraft types, which are accessible via the National Archives of Australia's website (www.naa.gov.au -> Explore the collection). When I reviewed the 11 files about accidents involving the Commonwealth Aircraft Corporation Boomerang (for a project I am carrying out), I spotted some fatal accidents that the RAAF attributed to human error.

For example, file NAA: A9845, 207, Boomerang A46 [Accidents Part 8], states that RAF Flying Officer Anthony Brook (on exchange to the RAAF) crashed Boomerang A46-170 during a transfer flight in January 1945 where "The symptoms indicated the pilot skidded or turned suddenly to lose speed, whereupon a rudder lock developed...and is likely to cause the pilot, especially if he is inexperienced in this type, to lose control for a short period..." (page 43).

Another incident where pilot error was identified was the fatal crash of Flying Officer Douglas Wilson on 1 May 1944, in A46-71, when practising formation flying. The RAAF determined that the probable cause of the accident was poor technique by Wilson when he attempted to loop the aircraft (NAA: A9845, 143, Boomerang A46 [Accidents Part 5], pages 28–32).

If you have lots of time on your hands, you could locate the relevant files (using the search terms Accidents and aircraft types and date range = years 1939 - 1945) and review them to identify reports similar to the two above. Clearly a case of looking through a number of haystacks to find an unknown number of needles (i.e. situation normal for aviation researchers).

Hope that is of some help and good luck with your project.

Don W
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