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  #101  
Old 22nd May 2014, 21:03
Larry Hickey Larry Hickey is offline
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Seeking source for WIA report for Lt Georg Dörffel, pilot in 5.(S)/LG2

Hello,

In working on the casualty reports for II.(S)/LG2 for the Western Campaign I found this entry in John Weal's book "Luftwaffe Schlachtgruppen" by Osprey for 14 May 1940:

"a third Hs123 crashed after being severely damaged by anti-aircrafat fire over Tirelmont, to the south-east off Louvain. The pilot, Leutnant Georg Dörffel of 5 Staffel, escaped with slight injuries. He was soon back in action only to be wounded a second time and forced down at St Pol exactly a fortnight later (hardly an auspicious debut for someone who was to become one of the three greats of the Schlact arm, winning the Oak Leaves and rising to the command of a Geschwader before being killed in action in Italy in 1944)."

In digging into the further, I found in "Die Ritterkreuzträger der Luftwaffe 1939-1945, Band II Stuka - und Schlchtflieger," P. 46, pilot's bio for Obstlt Georg Dörffel:

"...Mit wurde er an 14,5,1940 bei Tirlemont (Belgien) und im Juni 1940 bei Dünkirchen jeweils verwundet abgeschossen...," which may well be the source of Weal's information.

We find two documented losses for the unit that day:

"14 May 1940 Western Front: 5.(S)/LG2 Henschel Hs123 A-1. Shot down by No.607 Squadron Hurricanes near Saint-Germain 10.55 a.m. FF Uffz Karl-Siegfried Lückel wounded. Aircraft 100% write-off.

14 May 1940 Western Front: 5.(S)/LG2 Henschel Hs123 A-1. Shot down by No.607 Squadron Hurricanes near Saint-Germain 10.55 a.m. FF Lt Georg Ritter believed wounded. Aircraft 100% write-off.
One of these aircraft landed intact at ‘Le Gibet’, Jausselette, east of Perwez, the other exploded on impact behind the Godechoul Farm on the road to Grand-Rosière-Hottomont."

Peter Cornwell has researched the Dörffel reports but finds: "No mention of this loss in the relevant QMG Returns nor the NVM for II.(S)/LG2. It is not included in either Jim Perry’s nor Matti Salonen’s listings so I must remain dubious. Also the NVM confirms that the other two losses were due to fighter attack and not AA fire as stated by Weal. ‘Slight injuries’ could explain absence from the NVM..."

Does anyone have any further documentation on this incident? We have photos of a 5.(S)/LG2 Hs123, L2+BN, that belly landed during May, reportedly in the area of ""Gembloux," Belgium. This doesn't seem to match the reports of the incidents that we accept on 14 May. But this could also be the Dörffel incident, if it can be substantiated. Can anyone provide further documentation on the location, date and/or pilot of the "Gembloux" belly landing of L2+BN, or otherwise help document the Dörffel incident? At present, Peter is not inclined to add the Dörffel incident to our comprehensive loss/damages DB without further evidence and specifics.

Who can help?
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  #102  
Old 23rd May 2014, 00:39
Pieter H Pieter H is offline
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Re: Seeking source for WIA report for Lt Georg Dörffel, pilot in 5.(S)/LG2

Hi Larry, Peter,

I have no answer to your question on Dörffel, but a slight correction to Peter's entries. I think this happened not at 10.55 but 8.55 local time. The 607 Sqn account mentions this timing, and it matches the claims of 4./JG2 (Fw Karl-Heinz Harbauer and Ltn Hans Hahn) at 09.55 German time, which were two 607 Sqn Hurricanes. 9.55 GT was 8.55 BST local time, not 10.55, which is where the error probably comes from.
Similar correction must then be applied to the 607 Sqn entries in Peters list.

Kind regards, Pieter
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  #103  
Old 23rd May 2014, 00:51
Pieter H Pieter H is offline
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Re: Seeking SN of 88 SQ Fairey Battle RHoR abandoned in Hangar at Mourmelon AF, France, during May, 1940

Hi Martin,

I think we all have the same picture to look at, but when I zoom in I see with some level of certainty L?5?7. The first number is damaged but I see something circular at the bottom, so 5 not unlikely. The third number is a smudge, so could be anything. Given the series of L5520 aircraft used by No. 88 Sqn that seemed plausible, but am open to any better interpretation.

Regards, Pieter
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  #104  
Old 23rd May 2014, 02:56
Martin Gleeson Martin Gleeson is offline
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Re: Seeking SN of 88 SQ Fairey Battle RHoR abandoned in Hangar at Mourmelon AF, France, during May, 1940

Hallo Pieter,

One day I am sure a better photo will reveal the serial !
Meanwhile the last digit of '7' puzzles me. As far as I can tell 88 Squadron had no Battles in use on 10 May 1940 with the serial ending in '7'. On that date also they only had two Battles in the 'L55xx' serial range; L5526 and L5581 which was lost on May 14th.
The search goes on !

Regards,

Martin.
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  #105  
Old 23rd May 2014, 05:23
Larry Hickey Larry Hickey is offline
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Re: Seeking source for WIA report for Lt Georg Dörffel, pilot in 5.(S)/LG2

Pieter,

Thanx for the help. I'm sure that Peter C. will sort that out.

In the meantime, I've received four excellent new photos of the aircraft that landed intact at ‘Le Gibet’, Jausselette, east of Perwez. One of them, besides confirming the Perwez location in a caption, notes that it had 50 MG bullet holes in it. Two of the new photos show several German recon motorcycle troops in full combat gear visiting the downed plane, which indicates that it came down very close to the advancing German front line, probably one of the 5 Staffel losses on 14 May. Can anyone confirm when the German front line in Belgium reached the Perwez area? If it was 14 May this would confirm that it is one of the 14 May losses, despite the absence of unit codes (see below).

The photos also show that the a/c did not yet carry a unit code but still had its factory SKZ, apparently GW+MO, on what appears to be a new or newly refurbished a/c. The a/c had apparently been recently assigned as a replacement, possibly to 5.(S)/LG2, just before the WC began, and unit painters had not yet had time to apply either the unit coding or the 5 Staffel insignia before it was shot down. The camouflage paint job looks very crisp and new. Does the Hs123 SKZ GW+MO translate into a specific W.Nr., which would then tell us whether it is an A-1 or a B-1?

Most likely this is either the a/c of Uffz Karl-Siegfried Lückel, or Lt Georg Ritter both of which were WIA and apparently escaped capture. But which one? They apparently came down with 2-3km of each other. Does anyone have photos of a Hs123 crashed and exploded at Grand-Rosière-Hôtômont?

Does anyone have any further info on either of these losses or the possible wounding of Lt. Georg Dörffel on the same day? If the report is accurate, I'm assuming that Dörffel brought his aircraft back to base, which would eliminate the likelyhood of the "Le Gibet" a/c being his. From the five photos we now have it it, we know that this Hs123 sat out in the field for several weeks after landing by the growth of the field crop around it. This means that it should have been carried in the LW reports, at least initially, as a 100% loss, despite appearing to be relatively intact.

Still need some help here.
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  #106  
Old 23rd May 2014, 06:27
Larry Hickey Larry Hickey is offline
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Re: Seeking source for WIA report for Lt Georg Dörffel, pilot in 5.(S)/LG2

Correction to last post:

The SKZ should read GW+NO vice GW+MO.
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  #107  
Old 23rd May 2014, 14:40
lilsis lilsis is offline
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Re: Seeking source for WIA report for Lt Georg Dörffel, pilot in 5.(S)/LG2

Hi,

From my College for Larry

In an old germn privte script there i the date 17. Mai 1940 for Tienen, in Juni it is St. Pol near Duinkirchen.


Regards
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  #108  
Old 24th May 2014, 23:07
Larry Hickey Larry Hickey is offline
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Trying to sort out color profile of Bf110C-1 of Hptm Wolfgang Falck as Gr Kdr of I./ZG1 circa 04.40.

Hello,

I'm trying to create a profile package for the a/c of Hptm Wolfgang Falck as Gr Kdr of I./ZG1 circa 04.40. This was right after he achieved his 8th victory and while he would have been based at Aalborg-West AF, Denmark. When he took over as Gr Kdr on 19.02.40 from his previous position of Sta Kap of 2./ZG76, he apparently took his old a/c with him, which was coded M8+GK. Photos exist of his starboard tailplane removed due to combat damage (flak or fighters) sometime after his 8th victory in Denmark on 09.04.40. My questions are:

1) Does anyone know the date of the damage to his a/c requiring the removal of his starboard tail fin and rudder? Any circumstances? This has to have been on or later than 09.04.40 as photos of the tail at that time show all eight of his victories to that time applied.

2) A photo from that period shows his a/c code as 2N+GK, with the old M8 unit code painted out and replaced with 2N, the code for ZG1. Was that later repainted with the code 2N+GB?

3) Was his old 2./ZG76 "ladybird" emblem on a white shield still on the aircraft during this period?

4) Was a double chevron Gr Kdr insignia added to his a/c code 2N+GK, as would have been the usual practice with the Stab of I./ZG1?

5) Did Falck get a new aircraft sometime after that but before he moved on to nightfighters in June, 1940?

Any help or photos would be appreciated.
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Last edited by Larry Hickey; 24th May 2014 at 23:42.
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  #109  
Old 24th May 2014, 23:26
Larry Hickey Larry Hickey is offline
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Need info on accidental attack on German field airfield by Hs123s of II.(S)/LG2 on May 21, 1940

Hello,

In our EoE work with the German microfilms during the Western Campaign, and trying to match photos with a/c loss/damage reports for the Hs123s of II.(S)/LG2, we've discovered the following incident:

"on 21.5.40: at 20.50 hrs a squadron of Hs 123 mistakenly bombed a (German) field airdrome - at Allonville - where 4.(H)/31 and 2.(H)/23 (were located). 2.(H)/23 suffered 3 KIA , 3 seriously WIA and 4.(H)/31 one seriously wounded. One Hs 126 was heavily damaged. 1 (attacking) Hs 123 was shot down by the AA defense but the pilot was unhurt."

This incident was apparently hushed up at the time and we have no record from LW reports of this probably crash-landed Hs123, including its Staffel or the name of the pilot involved. I know that it's a long shot, but I'm hoping that someone may have run across some further information that would allow us to track down the specifics of this incident, particularly the Staffel involved. Allonville is apparently a town just north of Amiens, France. If the Hs123 force-landed, as appears likely, this could complicate our efforts to match photos of crashes with loss reports, especially since we don't even know the Staffel of the a/c that we're looking for. Its possible someone has run across photos of the damage to the recon unit a/c or a downed Hs123 captioned at or near Allonville, France.

Can anyone help?
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  #110  
Old 31st May 2014, 20:09
Larry Hickey Larry Hickey is offline
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Seeking info on three Do18 crewmen from 2./KüFlGr906 rescued by U-30 on 28.03.40

Hello,

Seeking crew names/ranks/positions for three men from 2./KüFlGr906 rescued by U-30 on 28.03.40: Ipach, Blanke & Rusch. The U-boat picked these men, plus a known BM, Fw Hans Biegel, up from sea NW of Hörnum after their Do18 force-landed during a search mission on that day.

Does anyone have this information?
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Last edited by Larry Hickey; 31st May 2014 at 21:40.
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