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  #1  
Old 27th November 2017, 19:23
Roundway Roundway is offline
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Luftwaffe activity west of Brest 19 December 1942?

At 0215 GMT on 11 December 1942 a Harrow aircraft of 271 Squadron took off from Portreath en route to Gibraltar. Nothing more was heard from the aircraft, but during the following weeks two bodies washed ashore near Brest, and two more on the Cherbourg Peninsula.

Is there a record of any Luftwaffe activity during the early hours of 11 December which might have accounted for the Harrow's disappearance?

Brian
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Old 27th November 2017, 19:56
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dahiot daniel dahiot daniel is offline
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Re: Luftwaffe activity west of Brest 19 December 1942?

Hello,
On 12 December, the Mustang Mk. Ia AG643, was shot down by 2 Me 109 and disappeared at sea to Batz Island.
By cons I do not have the serial of this Harrow and names of airmen.
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Old 28th November 2017, 01:12
Roundway Roundway is offline
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Re: Luftwaffe activity west of Brest 19 December 1942?

Thank you, Dan,

The Harrow was K7011, and carrying four crew plus 7 passengers:

Crew
S/Ldr (70089) Godfrey Allison Brown (33) RAFVR - Missing
F/Lt (72991) Edward Thomson Halley RAFVR - Missing
P/O (132123) Peter Marsh Burton (20) RAFVR -
(Plouhinec Communal Cemetery)
F/O 115669 Edwin Buckley Bowen (27) RAFVR
(Buried Le Rozel Churchyard, Manche)

Passengers
P/O 132361 William Milton Henderson (24) RAFVR
( Cherbourg Old Cemetery, Manche, Normandy)
Lt Andrew Jervis Hawkins (21) RN HMS Formidable
(Lanildut Churchyard)

F/O 118987 John Glen McCauley (30) RAFVR (NZ) - Missing
Flt/Sgt 926796 Richard George Brett RAFVR - Missing
Flt/Sgt 643049 John Brister (21) RAF - Missing
LAC 936370 Philip Cashmore (22) RAFVR - Missing
Major 136336 Harold John Palmer (48) 140 'Z' Battery, Royal Artillery - Missing.

Brian

Last edited by Roundway; 29th November 2017 at 21:38. Reason: CWGC has Henderson as F/O London Gazette has P/O
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Old 28th November 2017, 03:20
Col Bruggy Col Bruggy is online now
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Re: Luftwaffe activity west of Brest 19 December 1942?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roundway View Post
Thank you, Dan,

The Harrow was K7011, and carrying four crew plus 7 passengers:

Crew
S/Ldr (70089) Godfrey Allison Brown (33) RAFVR - Missing
F/Lt (72991) Edward Thomson Halley RAFVR - Missing
P/O (132123) Peter Marsh Burton (20) RAFVR -
(Plouhinec Communal Cemetery)
F/O 115669 Edwin Buckley Bowen (27) RAFVR
(Buried Le Rozel Churchyard, Manche)

Passengers
F/O 132361 William Milton Henderson (24) RAFVR
( Cherbourg Old Cemetery, Manche, Normandy)
Lt Andrew Jervis Hawkins (21) RN HMS Formidable
(Lanildut Churchyard)

F/O 118987 John Glen McCauley (30) RAFVR (NZ) - Missing
Flt/Sgt 926796 Richard George Brett RAFVR - Missing
Flt/Sgt 643049 John Brister (21) RAF - Missing
LAC 936370 Philip Cashmore (22) RAFVR - Missing
Major 136336 Harold John Palmer (48) 140 'Z' Battery, Royal Artillery - Missing.

Brian
Hello,

I have some doubts about 936370 LAC Philip CASHMORE RAFVR being aboard No.271 Sqn Harrow K7011. I think it is more likely he was aboard the S.S. "Strathallan" which was torpedoed by U-562 on 21 December,1942.

Possibly, the CWGC has mistakenly entered "271 Squadron RAF", in lieu of, "No.2771 Sqn RAF Regiment.

Needs more research.

Col.

Last edited by Col Bruggy; 28th November 2017 at 04:21.
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Old 28th November 2017, 19:48
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Re: Luftwaffe activity west of Brest 19 December 1942?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Col Bruggy View Post
Hello,

I have some doubts about 936370 LAC Philip CASHMORE RAFVR being aboard No.271 Sqn Harrow K7011. I think it is more likely he was aboard the S.S. "Strathallan" which was torpedoed by U-562 on 21 December,1942.

Possibly, the CWGC has mistakenly entered "271 Squadron RAF", in lieu of, "No.2771 Sqn RAF Regiment.

Needs more research.

Col.
It is unlikely that he was lost aboard STRATHALLAN as his name is not on the list about personnel reported dead or missing that was compiled by the CO of Troops after the sinking. 16 people were lost, including 5 RAF personnel and their names can be found here: https://uboat.net/allies/merchants/crews/ship2528.html
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Old 28th November 2017, 21:55
Roundway Roundway is offline
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Re: Luftwaffe activity west of Brest 19 December 1942?

Thank you for all your comments, gentlemen.

Chris. There were no radio transmissions according to the F1180; it simply records A/C missing in transit with 11 casualties.

Weather is certainly another option; the chart at the time the aircraft left Portreath showed an active frontal system approaching 10W. From the information available I'd estimate the freezing level to be 8000-10000 ft, so icing might have had a role to play.

If the F1180 is to be believed although the pilot had 129 hours on type, and the co-pilot 350, neither had any night-flying experience on type - which seems a little strange.

Col. I suspect that all RAF/RAFVR personnel were listed as members of 271 Squadron for the duration of the flight irrespective of their normal unit. F/O W M Henderson (132361), for example, was a meteorologist en route to a Mediterranean posting. If that is the case then the CWGC's error is in listing Cashmore's death as being on the 21st instead of the 19th.

Dan. Thanks for the additional information about Lt Andrew Jervis Hawkins, RN.

Brian
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Old 29th November 2017, 07:18
Col Bruggy Col Bruggy is online now
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Re: Luftwaffe activity west of Brest 19 December 1942?

Rainer,

I had already checked your passenger list for the S.S."Strathallan". I also checked the passenger listing, here:

http://thestrathallan.com/PDF/Crew_%...justed2017.pdf

I couldn't find mention of Cashmore in either of them, hence his prescence on the Strathallan was mentioned merely as a possibility.

I did not have access to the F1180, that Brian quotes from, which mentions 11 casualties aboard Harrow K7011. Most of the references I had seen mentioned 10 casualties, ie 4 crew & 6 passengers. What swayed my judgement a little was the fact that the CWGC quoted the date of death for Cashmore as 21 December, 1942, plus the fact that there was at least two members (Alf BLACKETT & Norman LENNOX), of No.2771 RAF Sqn Regt on the Strathallan.

I have a open mind on the matter, if Cashmore is proven to have been aboard K7011, that's fine by me.

Col.

Last edited by Col Bruggy; 1st December 2017 at 04:04.
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Old 28th November 2017, 14:11
Roundway Roundway is offline
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Re: Luftwaffe activity west of Brest 19 December 1942?

Thanks, Col, I simply copied out the list that has appeared several times in the past. The 271 ORB did not record the crew/passenger manifest, simply that the aircraft was missing. Although I knew it would be a long shot, it's the cause of the missing I was after, and wanted to rule out enemy action - which we seem to have done.

Brian
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Old 28th November 2017, 15:52
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Re: Luftwaffe activity west of Brest 19 December 1942?

I would have thought that any route would have been to take them as far away from German aircraft as possible. Luftflotte 3 reports are very detailed that day with quite a bit of activity but absolutely no mention of anything like a Harrow
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Old 28th November 2017, 16:32
Roundway Roundway is offline
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Re: Luftwaffe activity west of Brest 19 December 1942?

Yes, I agree Chris. I was just double-checking to make sure before writing a biography of one of the passengers. From the locations where bodies drifted ashore I guesstimated the loss probably occurred about an hour into the flight in the region of 49N 08W . I appreciate the dangers of attempting to work back from a body's landfall, but with two on the Brest peninsula, and two on the northern part of the Cherbourg peninsula, I felt that was a reasonable start point.

I suppose what I'm trying to say is that the loss occurred during the very early part of the flight rather later.

Brian
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