Oblot Max Dobislav claims 11.07.1940

[Witold K.]

Good afternoon
I try to connect Dobislav's claim from July 11 1940 with 609 Sqn losses. His claim almost for shure concerns loss of Spitfire L1095 of P/O Gordon Mitchell, but what about L1069 of F/L Phillip Barran?
All the best

[Chris Goss]

There were two claims that combat (Dobislav and Franzisket) for a Spitfire and Hurricane and 2 Spitfires (Mitchell and Barran) and one Hurricane (Dixon) lost. Either or I would say but there was talk that Barran was lost to return fire but there were no claims by StG 2

[Witold K.]

Thank You for answer
Franzisket claim its almost certainly Dixon's Hurricane shot down an hour before Mitchell and Barran. Accord. to some sourcess Barran' Spitfire was seriously damaged and pilot tried to reach a land but finaly his engine stoped forcing pilot to bale out. Is it possible that Oblt Dobislav first damaged Barran's Spitfire but then fired on the other one flown by Mitchell and seein it crash in water claimed it as shure Abschuss?
All the best

[Chris Goss]

We will never know as all records says one Hurricane and one Spitfire and if a German pilot did not see it crash he would not have submitted a claim. The only way of knowing is the testimony of Dobislav and he is no longer with us so that would leave his diary or possibly his FB

[Witold K.]

Well, another interesting thing are British claims that day; 1-0-0 Bf 109 and 0-1-0 Stuka at 08.05. Are there any known Luftwaffe losses from that combat?

[Chris Goss]

Just a Stuka of 9./StG 2 which according to German sources was seen to crash into the sea and sink immediately

[Witold K.]

And IV(Stuka)./LG 1? In Brian Cull's Battle for the Channel I've found crew Uffz Wolwgang Grosch and Uffz Horst Fietz KIA and other Stuka crashland in Saint-Inglevert with crew unhart

[Chris Goss]

Ste Inglevert was too far away from this action. IV./LG 1 did not operate this far west

[Peter Cook]

I agree with Chris on the claims

You may be interested in the 609 Squadron ORB Form 540 remarks about this combat - the Intelligence Officer clearly took a dim view of sending 5 Spitfires (later joined by 3 Hurricanes of 501) to tackle an estimated (by F/O Little) 'Ju 87 (about 10) Me 109 (about 20)'.

609 Squadron ORB Form 540 - Summary of Events - July 11
Airfield: Middle Wallop - The aircraft left for Warmwell at dawn. At approximately 08.00 hours, five aircraft of "B" Flight intercepted a number of Ju 87s attacking a convoy off Portland. F/Lt. Barran was shot down and his body subsequently recovered from the sea. P/O Mitchell failed to return and is reported as missing. See attached Combat Reports.
The utter futility of sending very small sections of fighters to cope with the intense enemy activity in the Portland area is bitterly resented by the pilots. The fact that they have so often been sent off to make an interception - as a Section, or possibly a Flight - only to find themselves hopelessly outnumbered by enemy fighters acting as guard to the enemy bombers, is discouraging because the British fighter then finds himself unable to do his job of destroying the bombers and is compelled to fight a defensive action. The situation is keenly felt by this Squadron, whose 'score' of enemy aircraft is in too close a ratio to its own losses. It is felt that we happen to have been particularly unlucky in that both at Dunkirk and at Portland our contacts with the enemy have taken place when the numerical odds were rather too unreasonable.
Source for Data: The National Archives Air 27/2102/13

If you are interested I have copies of the combat reports for Blayney and Little of 609 Squadron, plus Casualty Files for Mitchell and Barran of 609 and Dixon of 501.

[Stig Jarlevik]

Originally Posted by Witold K.

And IV(Stuka)./LG 1? In Brian Cull's Battle for the Channel I've found crew Uffz Wolwgang Grosch and Uffz Horst Fietz KIA and other Stuka crashland in Saint-Inglevert with crew unhart

Grosche and Fietz were the crew of the Stuka from 9./StG 2 as given by Chris above

My sources just mentions one combat. No 609 and 501 Sq tried to work together here and there is not one hour difference between claims and losses as indicated in post 3.

B Rgds
Stig