Missing Lufwaffe Pilots

[peter monasso]

From the inheritance of JG 3 Fw 190 Pilot Karl Kleinemeier I found a few pictures of his colleagues from JG 3 f.i. one of Karl Kosse. On the back of the photograph is written: Hptm. Kosse Staffelführer 13./Sturm/JG Udet vom Feindflug nicht zurück gekehrt am 24.12.44. südostlich Lüttich.” Did anyone of you ever heard if he and his plane were found somewhere near Liege ?? The 2nd picture is of Uffz. Robert Canaris . He is also mentioned as Kosse in the Vermisstenbildliste of the German Red Cross of 1957 for 13. and 14. Staff. JG 3 as "missing near Prenzlau" for March 1945. Does anyone know if he was ever found ??
Peter Monasso

[peter monasso]

Sorry for the mistakes: "Missing Luftwaffe Pilots" is not of course Karl Kosse but must be: Wolfgang Kosse.
Peter Monasso

[Adriano Baumgartner]

Peter,

Have you searched about Wolgang Kosse?
http://www.luftwaffe.cz/kosse.html

Send me your email, I will try to send you something.

Adriano Baumgartner

PS: By the way, there is some books about Mackie available. Maybe you can find something additional on his own war diary.

[Adriano Baumgartner]

Christmas Eve over Eindhoven

On Christmas Eve 1944, Tempests from 274 Squadron were returning from a Patrol over Aachen. They ran into FW 190s that had just downed two Canadian Typhoons over the Malmedy area. Evan "Rosie" Mackie, later to become Wing Commander (DFC, DFC (US), DSO), filed the following report:
"I was flying No.2 to Talbot Leader in Red Section on a patrol Julich-Malmedy and while we were returning to base and approaching Eindhoven, I noticed approx. 8 Typhoons flying in the opposite direction at about 4,000 ft. They were in open formation. When almost abreast of these A/C at about 6,000 ft I noticed one of the Typhoons suddenly break formation and dive into the ground on fire and I did not see anybody bale out. I then noticed the machine which had been flying behind that one, had moved behind another Typhoon, which then began shedding large pieces and losing height. Although we were not close enough to these aircraft to identify one of them as an enemy, I realised that this particular one must have been, so I immediately jettisoned my long-range tanks and gave chase.
There was no R/T communication between myself and the other members of the section, as I had not heard the order to change to channel 'A'. The E/A lost some height then pulled vertically upwards. I identified it as a short nosed FW190 and opened fire with four cannons at a range of about 250 yds closing to 50 yds. I then broke off the attack as I was then rolling over on to my back. I gave about a 2 1/2 sec. burst and numerous strikes were seen on the wings and centre section of the FW190 by myself and F/L Malloy who was flying Red 3. After I broke away, S/L Baird stated that the FW190 levelled out, going very slowly, dropped a wing and then spun into the ground approx. 4 miles SE of Eindhoven, where it blew up."
It appeared that Mackie had shot down Hauptmann Wolfgang Kosse, Staffelkapitän of 13 Staffel, IV/JG3.

[peter monasso]

Hi Adriano,
2nd Tactical Air Force Logbook says on page 136: "Dec.24 1944 274 Sqdn S/L. Mackie 1 FW.190 destroyed. E/A shot down at E.5104 after destroying 2 Typhoons." This could have been indeed the Fw190 of Kosse. E.5104 is a point between Maarheeze and Leende in The Netherlands but in the Dutch Loss List there is no Fw 190 as a real loss for this date at this point only a suggestion. I know http://www.luftwaffe.cz/kosse.html but this doesn't give the crash site for Kosse neither. Maybe he crashed just over the border somewhere in Belgium ? I was just wondering if someone did know anything about an excavation of Kosse and his Fw 190 during the past 60 years.
regards,
Peter
www.crashmuseum.nl
e: monassop@xs4all.nl

[John Manrho]

Hptm. Wolfgang Kosse is still missing and he was NOT shot down near Maarheze, that is another Fw 190.

John

[Doug Stankey]

For what it is worth, here is what we have about this fellow:

KOSSE, Wolfgang. (DOB: 27.09.18 in Berlin). 23.08.40 Oblt., appt Staka 5./JG 26 (to 04.05.42). 01.01.42 Oblt., Staka 5./JG 26 (to 04.05.42). 04.05.42 trf to Schiessschule Grove. 05.05.42 appt Staka 1./JG 5 (to 15.05.43 then trf to Schiesschule Grove/Denmark). 10.42 Oblt., Staka 1./JG 5. 01.04.43 in I./JG 5, promo to Hptm. (RDA to be determined). 30.11.43 demoted to Flieger and relieved of his command for making an unauthorised flight and damaging an aircraft. 01.44 volunteered for posting to Sturmstaffel 1. 01.06.44 appt Staka 5./JG 5 (to 13.10.44). 14.10.44 Hptm., appt Staka 10./JG 3 (to 24.12.44). 24.12.44 MIA – in Fw 190 shot down during combat with Typhoon fighter-bombers near Liège/Belgium. Credited with c.10 (some sources claim at least 28) air victories.


We hope that thishelps.

HLdZ
DGS

[Adriano Baumgartner]

Peter, John and Doug,
I found a claim by Lt-Col. Kyle L. Riddle from 479th FG around 12:30hs, a Fw 190 shot down some 10-20 miles East of Liège...from a formation of 4 ships. Very interesting. Do you happen to have all the undiscovered Fw 190 losses that day? Maybe we could narrow down the 190 losses on Belgium...
Yours
Adriano Baumgartner

[Adriano Baumgartner]

Forgot to ask:
IF the Fw 190 claimed by S/L Mackie is NOT the machine flown by Hptm Kosse, do we have a possible victim that matches Mackie's claim ( near Maarheze )?

[ClinA-78]

Hello,

24th December 1944 was a busy day, especially in the Liege-Eupen area. Some crashsites have been located in that particular area but few identified... Interesting challenge to perform there.

Best regards.

ClinA-78