Fiat CR-32 production batches

[spanienflieger]

Hello everybody

I am researching about the Italian Fiat CR-32's that were sent to Spain during the vicious Spanish Civil War. I have located several C/n's of those aircraft (usually painted on the tail), and a chart with the different production batches and military registrations (Matricola Militare, MM). Here is a summarized version of the chart:

Type MM Production Qty C/N (?)
CR 32 2589-2870 mar-34/feb-36 282 ¿1-282?
CR 32bis 2957-3239 apr-36/jul-37 283 ¿283-565?
CR 32ter 3420-3569 jul-37/dic-37 150 ¿566-715?
CR 32quater 3892-4667 jan-38/may-39 337 ¿716-1052?


Unfortunately, manufacturing sequence and c/n's seem not to match. For example, aircraft with c/n 101x were sent to Spain in 1938, but according to the production batches those aircraft should have been manufactured in 1939. On the other hand, c/n 451 was captured in september, 1936, but according to the production batches that aircraft should have been manufactured in 1937.

Could anybody help me matching Matricola Militare with c/n's of this aircraft?

Thanks in advance

[Gianandrea Bussi]

As far as I know, there isn't any study about this subject.
Anyway, in compiling your chart you have to take into account also the prototypes and the aircraft built for the export (Hungary, China, Austria, Paraguay and Venezuela).

Gianandrea

[Tony Jones]

Hi

The Italian Airforce in Spain is covered in PRO docs HW21/1 etc. I don't know if this helps but an inventory on 7/4/37 states 45 CR-42 delivered by ship "Aniene" and under construction. It appears that these were provided in parts and assembled in Spain. Perhaps this could explain the difference dates for c/n.

As an aside I was at the PRO yesterday and looking at 11/43 files and many Italian a/c listed as being taken over by the LW. My query is with a typical item i.e CR 42 works number 8905 taken over. Was this the actual works number or was it the MM*** number. Works numbers are given for many Italian types but I suspect that these were all MM*** serials

Regards

Tony

[Gianandrea Bussi]

"8905" is, in fact, a Matricola Militare (military serial): CR.42 batch MM8844-8995.
What sort of documents are contained in the 11/43 files?
May you give other informations about the MM mentioned in them?
thank you

Gianandrea

[Tony Jones]

Gianandrea

I posted a reply but it didn't appear so appologies if thsi appears twice!!

I have been working through the HW 5 files at the PRO and there are many MM serials given for all a/c collected by the Luftwaffe. I have copied all these pages but the subject is still "ongoing" so more could be found next week. Please send me a private messgae with your details for me to send you some sample pages.

The HW 21 series is tilted "Italain Airforce" and the series progresses through the Spanish Civil War then Albania/Abysinia etc. This is "packed with MM serials and sometimmes c/n data. I copied sample pages for Spain but then stopped. The Alabania data from memeory was the serial for every a/c used there

Regards

Tony

[Stig Jarlevik]

Tony

What KIND of document is it you are reading?
Intelligence, where airframes have been looked at and c/n or MM number checked?
"Spy-version"?
Post-war documents where Italian sources have been used?
With post war in this case I mean post Italian surrender in 1943

Cheers
Stig

[Tony Jones]

Hi Stig

The HW 21 files are radio intercepts of Italian messages

The HW 5 series are the radio intercepts/ decode with enigma machine of German radio messages. Some interesting data here i.e maintenance on captured italian machines was banned late 1943 but early in 12/43 the ban was lifted and Italian a/c were then allowed to fly over Germany. 1944 gets very interesting as lots of crash data not found anywhere else.
I have also found an Italian Fi 156 serial that the LW was to reuse

Regards

Tony

[Stig Jarlevik]

Thanks Tony

Understand now why there are still much to be found in the British files.
Also thanks for the extras!!

Cheers
Stig

[spanienflieger]

Thank you very much for your answers.