Luftwaffe and Allied Air Forces Discussion Forum  

Go Back   Luftwaffe and Allied Air Forces Discussion Forum > Discussion > Allied and Soviet Air Forces

Allied and Soviet Air Forces Please use this forum to discuss the Air Forces of the Western Allies and the Soviet Union.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 1st March 2017, 15:04
Revi16 Revi16 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 915
Revi16 is on a distinguished road
Re: B-24 lost on May 18, 1944?

There doesn't seem to be any National Markings on the side of the aircraft either.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 1st March 2017, 18:53
researcher111's Avatar
researcher111 researcher111 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 976
researcher111 will become famous soon enough
Re: B-24 lost on May 18, 1944?

B-24 42-522253 made it back to Italy where had to be ditched ,as into the missing markings numerous Libs of the 15th AF which came back from Stage D maintainance and which immediately entered service did not carry any markings except reg.

Last edited by researcher111; 2nd March 2017 at 20:10.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 1st March 2017, 23:02
Sean Welch Sean Welch is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 23
Sean Welch is on a distinguished road
Re: B-24 lost on May 18, 1944?

After looking through the MACR's for this day, the aircraft involved must be 42-52253
German document KSU 1214 records that 6 crew bailed out and were captured in Seliski, near Tuzi, 18 km SE of Podgorica, in partisan territory. The other 4 crew were captured after the emergency landing at Podgorica Airport, 18th May, 1944 at 16:00 hours. The aircraft had made a belly landing but was in otherwise good condition. The landing gear was noted as damaged, the left outer propeller was broken (off) and a flak hit seen below the tail gun position. Markings and assignment numbers missing except on the left front fuselage below the cockpit: US Army B24 H-11 F. O. Air Force Serial No. 42-52253 Besides the number 90 389.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 2nd March 2017, 10:51
Boris Ciglic's Avatar
Boris Ciglic Boris Ciglic is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Alba Grecca
Posts: 278
Boris Ciglic
Re: B-24 lost on May 18, 1944?

Hello all,

It is not Podgorica airfield for sure. First, the surroundings visible on the photo do not fit. Second, clothes worn by the civilians are not what they would look in Montenegro at the time. Third, there is no way any locals could walk around the airfield and take photos. Podgorica was in the midst of the 'Bandengebiet' and very well defended.

Cheers,
Boris
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 2nd March 2017, 20:21
researcher111's Avatar
researcher111 researcher111 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 976
researcher111 will become famous soon enough
Re: B-24 lost on May 18, 1944?

Sean it could well be the 52253 because the shot clearly indicating a belly landing , however and that's the big however the 52253 departed with clearly visible markings
the one in question did not carry any and seems to have come out of stage D checks from Napoli. Strangely on the original shot posted even the Army AF roundel vanished.

Also,I must agree with Boris it does not seem close to any military airfield installation due to the crowd depicted on it, but I may be wrong .Btw the Nr 2 depicted on
the rudder it shows past 376th BG affiliation however the diamond on top is missing .

Alex Smart , NO WAY - the Lib you presumed of 460 BG was ditched while airborne, crashed and was consumed by post crash fire

Last edited by researcher111; 13th March 2017 at 18:29.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 2nd March 2017, 20:30
researcher111's Avatar
researcher111 researcher111 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 976
researcher111 will become famous soon enough
Re: B-24 lost on May 18, 1944?

These are the Libs lost on May 18,44 to/frm Ploesti mission
....however if the date provided by Theodor isn't correct we
are looking for a needle on haystack .


42-29246
42-78081
42-52253
42-64347
42-52351
41-29576
42-52355
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 12th July 2017, 22:31
Dénes Bernád Dénes Bernád is offline
Alter Hase
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Hungary
Posts: 1,638
Dénes Bernád is on a distinguished road
Re: B-24 lost on May 18, 1944?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Welch View Post
If this is the aircraft 2 miles south of Tarnak it is BOOMERANG BETSY, 42-64347 of the 455BG/743BS, based in San Giovanni, Italy. (...)The pilot Markham (...).
What was the pilot's full name and rank, please?
__________________
Dénes
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 12th July 2017, 23:05
Kutscha Kutscha is offline
Alter Hase
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,045
Kutscha
Re: B-24 lost on May 18, 1944?

Quote:
Originally Posted by researcher111 View Post
A small addition , Markham was executed after numerous interrogations and severe torture by the Bulgarians who were convinced he was spying for OSS. In fact he bravely declined to identify his own crew members during the interrogation. An other pilot detained in Sofia was also executed on same grounds ( I wounder about the identity of the 2nd pilot ) . One of the problems was that Markham was arrested by a Fascist Militia during his train ride wearing civilian clothes claiming to be fighter pilot and later on was not able to produce his dog tag . In fact Gen Hall's mission later on in 1944 /45 was to put on trial those who tortured and murdered US airmen in Bulgaria. Last addition, the entire crew bailed out near Pleven (BUL) at or about an alt of 3'000 ft , the wreckage depicted above is of a Lib which executed a forced landing rather an aircraft ditched at the mentioned altitude , therefore it must belong to an other aircraft.

Alex K

PS : The shot above could well be this of 42-78081
Alex just because the a/c is not in little pieces does not mean it didn't 'crash'. There are many instances of a/c coming down with no one at the controls and surviving mainly intact.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 13th July 2017, 00:24
Frank Olynyk Frank Olynyk is offline
Alter Hase
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,103
Frank Olynyk is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: B-24 lost on May 18, 1944?

Dénes,

2nd Lt Thomas J Markham, O803340. I have him as "shot while escaping" which may just be what was officially reported.

Enjoy!

Frank.
__________________
Civilization is the most fragile ecology of all.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 13th July 2017, 20:46
researcher111's Avatar
researcher111 researcher111 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 976
researcher111 will become famous soon enough
Re: B-24 lost on May 18, 1944?

Frank " shot while escaping " this what may have happened , do you have any records about this event ? The MACR has no many relevant details on the execution . While looking into Gen.Hall mission report who came to Bulgaria to trail the atrocities at Schumen as well a book written by Lt H.A. Walker "Leave us not be bitter " who was an ex POW at Schumen, I could not find any details as into Markham's execution .
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
A P51 lost in February 1945 at La neuveville sous Montfort (Vosges Departmen=t gilles collaveri Allied and Soviet Air Forces 19 15th January 2013 09:27
night 17 to 18 july 1944 martin75 Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces 5 19th March 2011 19:33
Ju-88 lost 31 july 1944 martin75 Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces 2 20th September 2010 11:20
3 Ju88 KG77 lost july 1944 martin75 Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces 7 30th May 2010 10:24
Losses of B-17's in RCM role paul peters Allied and Soviet Air Forces 4 15th February 2006 21:57


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 18:26.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004 - 2018, 12oclockhigh.net