Derelict Aircraft at Airbase

[KMURPHY]

Hello again,
Here are some of the pictures that were given to me to look into for a friends family. They were taken by my friend's grandfather. He was an engineer in the ETO. He occupied enemy airfields and re-constructed them for Allied use. I have some pictures of a wide range of interesting German aircraft. All the pictures seem to date from early-mid Feb. 1945. I was hoping to find out as much as I can from the pictures if it is possible, and I would like to share them as well. Let me know about any comments. Sorry for the size, just wanted to leave the details in them.


"This Jerry plane crash landed on one of our 'dromes. Pilot was captured by G.B. men. I am sending you part of his parachute." Feb.4 1945


Feb. 4 1945


Feb. 1945


Feb. 1945


Feb. 4 1945


Feb. 1945


Feb. 1945


Feb. 1945


Feb. 4 1945


Feb. 1945

[KMURPHY]

See this thread for the second part. http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showthread.php?t=19699

[S Sheflin]

“KMURPHY,”

Thank you for posting these great photos.

Fw 190 A-8 WNr. 171680, “?+ - Bk o/l W”, was found destroyed at St. Dizier, France

Bf 109 G “14+ - Yellow,” TT+ED (EO?), (behind the Bf 110s), was also found at St. Dizier, France

He 111 H SA+CQ (CO?), was abandoned at Bad Langensalza

That is about all I know about these.

Again, thank you for sharing them.

Steve Sheflin

[ChristianK]

Ju 52 "A7+HL" of Lufttransportgruppe Rangsdorf is said to have been found at Mons, Belgium.

Regards,
Christian

[KMURPHY]

May be a very naive question to ask, but where do you find this kind of information available? Very interesting I think.

[Nick Beale]

Originally Posted by KMURPHY

May be a very naive question to ask, but where do you find this kind of information available? Very interesting I think.

A major source is file AIR40/45 at the British National Archives. This is a series of reports about captured, abandoned and shot down enemy aircraft. These reports vary a lot in the detail given (a new kind of aircraft always gets lots of attention) but this file is a good place to begin (there are lots of other archive sources that people use to supplement the information though).

[Mark Proulx]

Hi:

I believe the Bf 110 G images are from St. Dizier. To the left is C9+AK and to the right C9+IK. In the background is a Bf 109 G, Yellow 14, which was applied over factory codes TT+EO.

Mark Proulx

[KMURPHY]

How do you access these files if you don't mind me asking?

[KMURPHY]

Also, on the first FW-190 pictured, in your opinion, what colors are the numbers on the fuselage, as well as the tail band by the
~ symbol? I have a hard time telling, but I would like to find out
more, but there are few markings to go by on that one. THanks.

[S Sheflin]

KMURPHY,

You asked about the color of the markings and fuselage band of your beautiful Fw 190 A “17+ ~.” I have been thinking about it for a while.

First, knowing the location of the photo would be a great help. Barring that, lets assume that it was from a IV. Gruppe fighter unit, and what we see is actually an RV band. The band would be approximately 900 mm wide, displays a low gray value, and is slightly shiny.

The only Luftwaffe fighter units assigned single 900 mm RV bands are: JG 1 (red), JG 3 (white), JG 11 (yellow), JG 27 (green), JG 53 (black), and JG 54 (blue). JG 3’s white band is difficult to reconcile and can be eliminated. JG 27 and JG 53 are eliminated because they flew only Bf 109s. JG 1 and JG 11 can be eliminated because I believe they lacked IV. Gruppen. Finally, the unique shape of its wavy IV. Gruppe bar is typical of late war JG 54 aircraft. This suggests that “17+ ~” may have been from IV./JG 54, and carried a form of their blue RV band.

Its markings are more problematic. First, note that the gray value of its markings are darker than its supposedly blue fuselage band, but lighter than its all-black Hakenkreuze. Second, my JG 54 loss lists show only white, black, yellow, or blue markings. Third, photographs show that only 14./JG 54’s (black) and possibly 16./JG 54’s (blue) markings were outlined in white, while 13./JG 54’s white and 15./JG 54’s yellow numbers were not. Therefore, “17+ ~’s” markings were probably faded black, a form of blue, or less likely, green.

Steve Sheflin

PS: Has anyone been able to read the white script above the fuselage Balkenkreuz?
PPS: Does anyone know to what “captured by G.B. men” refers?