Greatest Jagdgeschwader 6 ace

[knusel]

Dear Johannes & Co,

I have found two entries for Gerhard Lange:
-Musciano (1994, p223) lists him as an ace with 5 kills who flew the Me 109.
-Toliver/Constable (1994, p400) list him as a Hauptmann with 5 kills who was a member of JG6.

Are you sure Fritz Stehle scored 5 JG6 kills ?

Cheers,

Michael

[John Manrho]

Johannes,

Yes, I know this document. It is the Erfahrungsbericht JG 6 for the time period 19.2.45-18.3.45. Quite an interesting document. Imho the high number of claims include the predecessor units. So for I./JG 6's 306 Abschüsse this would be;

I./Erpr.Gr. 210 -> I./SKG 210 -> I./ZG 1 -> I./ZG 26 and I./JG 6...

If anybody is interested....try the math...:-)

Interesting is also the claims of JG 6 total for this period (19.2.45-18.3.45).

20 einmot sicher
4 zweimot sicher
2 einmot wahrscheinlich

If you follow KTB Lf6 reports you will find 19 einmot sicher and 2 einmot wahrscheinlich for all three Gruppe combined. If you add one Lagg-3 claim for II./JG 6 of 18.2.45 you come to 20....pretty close....

However, no idea on the 4 -zweimot sicher.....Johannes, do you have an idea?

Regards,

John

[John Manrho]

Michael,

Yes, I have no more than 5 kills with JG 6 for Stehle.....if anybody knows more....I would be interested.... there is one but.....I have been unable to create a victory list for Stehle which closes all gaps....but JG 6 seems to match....

Hptm. Gerhard Lange....what you list as source are not primary sources and until today I found no trace of a (Hptm.) Gerhard Lange with JG 6.....I am still checking some records, but I doubt he was with JG 6 and we also still do not know any other details on him....

John

[Johannes]

Hi Michael

I agree with John. Cannot find any reference to Langer, and being a Hauptmann would suggest he would have been a Staffelkapitän or more. Don't believe too much from your Toliver/Constable book, like John said "primary source", without evidence your build false pictures. Judging by the Toliver/Constable Hartmann book they are wildly out on everything. My friend John Foreman always says "Once something is published, it's cast in stone".......basically believed and duplicated/copied.......even when incorrect.

Kind Regards

Johannes

[RT]

Some Hptm , coming from KG units, hv no particular leading title...could be

Rémi

[knusel]

BTW the name of this enigmatic guy is consistently Gerhard Lange (not Langer).
Omitting him who might be a phantom, could we agree on Fritz Stehle provisionally being the ranking Jagdgeschwader 6 ace with 5 kills ?

Have a nice evening,

Michael

[John Manrho]

Based on the currently available and published primary sources you could.

John

[knusel]

Thank you.
I'll let you know in this thread as soon as I receveice evidence for the being of "Gerhard Lange".

Have a nice Tuesday,

Michael

[knusel]

Hello,

Stehle has only 4 JG6 kills if one takes his 22-kill-list as a basis.
Can anybody explain the story behind the four additional kills (3 in ZG26, 1 in JG6) in his 26-kill-score ?

Michael

[John Manrho]

Michael,

I believe the 26 vic claim list is probably the truth.....there are records that Stehle had 10 victories when 5./ZG 26 became 6./JG 6. My question in the Me 410 Ace post was exactly about those 3 missing claims. Of course I have the 7 you mentioned which are in the films....The three missing could be scored with II./ZG 26 or III./ZG 1.....those are the ones I am looking for....

John