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Old 22nd July 2021, 21:17
INM@RLM INM@RLM is offline
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Soviet Bombing of German Armour in early days of Barbarossa: Army Grp South, 23-Jun-1941

This puzzling quotation appears at p.109 in Christer Bergstrom's Barbarossa (2016).
"Early on 23 June, a large formation of DB-3s from Bomber Corps 4 BAK caught a German tank column in open field. Vasiliy Kurayev, who served as a radio operator with bomber regiment 8 DBAP, recalled: "Our whole wing took off. There were nine formations of nine aircraft each. Without encountering any opposition, we detected a large German tank column in the vicinity of Shepetovka. We were instructed to attack individually. One by one our DB-3s made individual passes and bombed the column from an altitude of only 800 meters. The result was absolutely devastating." The source given is an interview with Vasiliy Kurayev himself.
Looking at the map of operations on 23 & 24 June on page 291 of Victor Kamenir's 'Bloody Triangle' it is clear that no German forces approached the Shepetovka area until early July 1941, so only as the border battles were finally winding to an end. Indeed this map shows that on 23 June the front lines were still over fifty miles west of Shepetovka. There is only one mention of 4 BAK in Kamenir's book (at pp. 236/7) and that confirms only that they took heavy losses but continued to operate even when there was no fighter escort.

At the most basic level either this incident did, or did not happen, but perhaps just not near Shepetovka, or not on the 23 June.
If it did happen, one would expect a mention in one of the German accounts. The German formation that would have suffered this bombing was 11 Panzer Div., however, I do not have either of Gustav Schrodek's books, one the history of the division, the other of its component 15.Pz.Regt. And indeed if it had been such a signal success one might also expect a mention of this attack in Soviet official records.
If the date and reference to Shepetovka are actually accurate though, the only logical conclusion seems to be that 4 BAK actually bombed their own forces, most probably from XV Mechanised Corps, headquartered at Brody, due west of Sheptovka.
The obvious, final possibility that must be considered though, is that Vasiliy Kurayev's account is just pure baloney; a tall tale served up to his interviewer by someone with a twisted sense of humour.

If anyone is able to throw a little more light on the circumstances of this bombing attack, whether from German or Soviet records, those clarifications would be helpful and much appreciated.

Last edited by INM@RLM; 23rd July 2021 at 13:54.
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Old 24th July 2021, 23:22
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Re: Soviet Bombing of German Armour in early days of Barbarossa: Army Grp South, 23-Jun-1941

Hello
You might get answers from the https://forum.axishistory.com/

A couple decades ago I read several unit histories of Panzer Divisions, including Schrodek's Die 11. Panzerdivision "Gespensterdivision" Bilddokumente 1940-1945 (1984). From my notes: a caption on the page 133 On 24th June 1941 While the armoured spearhead was attacked by Russian bombers
a caption on page 134 Heavy Russian artillery fire did not stop panzers.
Noting indicates that the bombing attack was particularly devastating, but as I said you will probably get much better answers from the Axis History Forum.

HTH
Juha
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Old 26th July 2021, 04:22
INM@RLM INM@RLM is offline
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Re: Soviet Bombing of German Armour in early days of Barbarossa: Army Grp South, 23-Jun-1941

Many thanks for those contributions, Juha. I'll try there next. Your pointer to the 24th June was invaluable though, because I had missed this reference on pp.139/40 in Kamenir's 'Bloody Triangle':
"As the panzer regiment [clearly 15.Pz.R. of 11.Pz.Div.] and its supporting elements were finishing taking up their positions [around 0600 hrs], the hum of multiple aircraft engines was heard approaching from the west. Soon, approximately a regiment-worth of heavy bombers flew over the German unit. Believing them to be their own aircraft, the German flak gunners did not even unlimber their canon. However, very soon red stars became visible on the wings of the large aircraft. Fortunately for the surprised Germans, they were not the intended target of the Soviet bombers, who continued droning on towards the east as if not even noticing German forces concentrated directly below them. It was also possible that the Soviet bomber force was returning to their home airfield after expending their entire payload on other targets." The source cited is Schrodek p.124 (presumably in his 15.Pz.Regt. history.)
That would seem to tell us this very large mission by 4 BAK did indeed take place, but in the early part of 24th June, not the 23rd. As far as the tanks of 11.Pz.Div were concerned though this was actually a non-bombing.

If this Soviet bomber formation then really dropped their bombs near Shepetovka, well east of the German forces at that moment lined up in front of Radekhov and duelling with the Soviet 10th Tank Division, then it could indeed only have been Soviet armour that they bombed.

I think what I'm after most now is some insight from Soviet records.
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Old 28th July 2021, 21:50
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Re: Soviet Bombing of German Armour in early days of Barbarossa: Army Grp South, 23-Jun-1941

Nice if I could be of help. I liked your Fw 200 threads a lot. There are a vast amount of really interesting information in them.

Juha
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Old 28th July 2021, 23:46
INM@RLM INM@RLM is offline
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Re: Soviet Bombing of German Armour in early days of Barbarossa: Army Grp South, 23-Jun-1941

Thank you for those kind words, Juha. Some significant updates are needed now on the Fw 200 C-5 thread for the builds after WNr. 0200.

Thanks to the generosity of benefactors that would prefer to remain anonymous, I now have access to the Dietrich Kracke Flugbuch (he was a Bordmonteur not an Einflieger, so his interest was in the equipment fitted to the aircraft rather than the aircraft itself), plus one other document has surfaced with some useful insights.

As ever, nothing complete and definitive; it's still a matter of piecing a jigsaw together but some further progress has, I think, been made. Just a question of writing out my findings clearly now, along with everything else I'm working on. Eyes bigger than my stomach is the appropriate phrase, I believe.
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