Fotii Morozov

[kirche]

31.01.1943 Morozov - Yak-1 №3579

In October-November 1942, there were five Yak-7bs in the 274 IAP, of which only one was serviceable (the others, Nos. 2548, 2561, 2510, 23109 were without engines). A serviceable aircraft flew combat sorties. On 10/30/1942, the Yak-7b was flown by St. Sergeant Levshenko.
From December 1942 to March (or April) 1943, there was only one Yak-7 No. 23109 in the 31st Gw.IAP (it was obtained from 274 IAP and apparently did not fly combat missions)

[knusel]

Good evening kirche and HGabor,

that sounds reasonable. Thanks for your posts.
I also invite you to my Soviet-top-aces-by-plane-thread:
http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showth...+aircraft+aces

Do you think that those who declared the P-51 the top-scoring Allied warplane have safely excluded the Soviet types ?

Cheers,

Michael

[HGabor]

Thank you Michael,
But I would not answer this question... These victory figures (claims) are just empty numbers, without a full investigation, it is impossible to tell whether they are correct or not. These claims were reported from many different fronts (West, East, South and North) so I think there is no human being on Earth who could start such a gigantic investigation in all available archives. (Not to mention that many Axis docs have been lost forever, so in some cases this investigation would be simply impossible.) Official claims can be compared easily (you listed them too), but as I said, they do not have too much historical value, since many of them could be full of overclaims.
Cheers,
Gabor

[knusel]

Hello HGabor,

in the abscence of complete loss records official victory listings are still worthwhile figures to compare. I wondered if those who name the P-51 the Allied top scorer (5666 USAAF kills + ??? RAF kills) have taken the time to estimate the total scores of the Spitfire, the Hurricane, the La-5, the P-39 and the Yak-9.

Have a nice evening,

Michael

[kirche]

Originally Posted by knusel

Do you think that those who declared the P-51 the top-scoring Allied warplane have safely excluded the Soviet types ?

Hello Michael,
My opinion is that the best Allied fighters that destroyed the most enemy aircraft are "USAAF + RAF bombers" and "Russian tanks and infantry". And you can count and compare anything and however you like, the main thing is not to look at how many it's percentages from the enemy produced and any conclusions will still be biased subjective opinion.
Kirill

[knusel]

Hello Kirill,

you mean that Russians tanks destroyed a large number of aircraft ?

Michael

[HGabor]

Personally I doubt that the Soviet tanks destroyed so many Axis aircrafts in combat.

I know about a single Junkers downed by a 9 GvMK, 46 GvTBr, 1st battalion M4A2 Sherman tank (commanded by Lt. Grigorii Timofeevich Verbovii) from the side of a railway line on December 11, 1944. This tank, by the way, was destroyed too just a few minutes later. Other sources say that this plane was downed by the 388th Guards Flak Regiment at Homok.

It is possible that many Axis planes were lost when Soviet tanks overrun their airfields, but they were captured, rather than destroyed in combat. Interestingly some Soviet Air Regiments had some tanks (mainly T-34s) as well beside their airplanes in order to provide continuous ground protection for their airbases.
Personally I think the Soviet AAA destroyed much more planes than the tank crews themselves, however, I have never seen any trustworthy study on this subject yet.

Gabor

[knusel]

Good morning Gabor and Kirill,

a similar issue is the question how feasible it is to verify the destruction of a tank by an aircraft. I often wondered which criteria Hans-Ulrich Rudel used to report the successful attack against a tank. Smoke from the tank ? Explosions ?? The tank stopping its drive ???

Cheers,

Michael