|
Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces Please use this forum to discuss the German Luftwaffe and the Air Forces of its Allies. |
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
#11
|
|||
|
|||
Re: Photograph of Willi Elstermann
Hi John,
Many thanks for these elaborate details about Elstermann's career and Abschüsse, most helpful indeed. I've deleted his September 42 claim -your info strengthens me in my belief that this victory claim was a Nonnenmacher/Ring 'invention'. Cheers, Theo |
#12
|
|||
|
|||
Re: Photograph of Willi Elstermann
John/Theo
Since Johannes seems not to be following this thread, he lists his two first victories in 1939 with 3./JGr 152 One Ms 406 on 24.9.1939 One Po 637 on 4.10.1939 Cheers Stig |
#13
|
|||
|
|||
Re: Photograph of Willi Elstermann
Thanks for that Stig, -it would be interesting indeed if John can follow up these two Abschüsse with Elstermann's Flugbuch entries!
Cheers, Theo |
#14
|
|||
|
|||
Re: Photograph of Willi Elstermann
Not sure where Johannes got his info from, I think we need some evidence... The one for 24/9/39 is listed in Prien's work but just as an assumption.
Although I really did not need to check the FB (as these two are not in my notes..) I did fetch the FB from the archived boxes and checked it; 24/9/39....11. Frontflug (17.04-18.10 Uhr Biblis), no remarks 4/10/39....did not fly.... The flight on 30/9/39 I mentioned in an earlier post was his 23. Frontflug (15.57-17.34 Uhr) and there he reported something that could be read as "Luftsieg"....but that is really all and I am simply not sure.... John Last edited by John Manrho; 7th October 2015 at 21:43. Reason: typo |
#15
|
|||
|
|||
Re: Photograph of Willi Elstermann
Thanks a lot John for clearing this up, much appreciated!
Cheers, Theo |
#16
|
|||
|
|||
Photograph of Willi Elstermann
Hi guys
Many thanks to all who have participated in this thread and in particular to John Manrho for his detailed post regarding the career of this pilot. I think that much of the confusion regarding any possible victories that Leutnant Willi Elstermann claimed with 2./JGr 152 is due to the fact that there was a Leutnant Horst Elstermann who simultaneously was serving with 3./JGr 152. This was the man that claimed victories on 24 September 1939 (and following the aerial combat had to perform a belly-landing near Weilerbach) and 6 October 1939. Apparently, there is some mixing of the details of the two men. Horrido! Leo |
#17
|
|||
|
|||
Re: Photograph of Willi Elstermann
Leo,
For me than the question pops up what kind of evidence we have concerning the claims of Lt. Horst Elstermann......where documented? Does anybody have an idea what happened to this Elstermann? Thanks, John |
#18
|
|||
|
|||
Re: Photograph of Willi Elstermann
No one? I would be interested to learn more about this Horst Elstermann and what kind of supportive evidence we have on the claims of this pilot.
John |
#19
|
|||
|
|||
Photograph of Willi Elstermann
Hi John
Honestly, I can be of little help as you have far better resource material available than I but his name does appear in various publications such as Fledgling Eagles by Shores and Ehrengardt as well as Die Jagdfliegerverbände der Deutschen Luftwaffe 1934 bis 1945 Teil 2 by Prien and his team. Unfortunately, information about JGr 152 and I./ZG 52 appears to be extremely fragmentary and often contradictory for what I have seen due to the loss of historical records. It certainly would be interesting to learn more about this pilot but I do wonder if that would be possible given what researchers such as Larry Hickey have stated regarding the lack of data for the Zerstörer units in 1939 and 1940. Horrido! Leo |
#20
|
|||
|
|||
Re: Photograph of Willi Elstermann
Leo,
Ok, already started digging.....does anybody know where the name Horst was mentioned? I am looking for the original source. Trying to solve the mix up.... regards, John |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
Grave visit yesterday Hptm. Willi Henke | Melvin Brownless | Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces | 0 | 20th September 2014 16:42 |
Trying to ID "Gefr Morzinek" of I. or II./JG2 from Oct-Nov 1940 time period | Larry Hickey | Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces | 6 | 28th September 2012 07:41 |
Willi Popper Gefallen? | Melvin Brownless | Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces | 3 | 21st January 2012 17:23 |
Stuka photograph mystery solved | biltongbru | Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces | 4 | 25th August 2010 15:34 |
Fähnrich Willi Söhnge KIA 15.07.44 | Melvin Brownless | Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces | 0 | 9th June 2008 19:32 |