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  #11  
Old 6th February 2020, 19:13
Stephen M. Fochuk Stephen M. Fochuk is offline
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Re: Rocket anti-aircraft fire

Late February 1944:

Two possible rockets were reported about 20 miles south-west of Brussels. Trails of smoke ended with puffs of white smoke. / One pilot reports seeing two possible rockets at 28,000 ft., above Wing 20 miles south-west of Brussels. Trails of smoke ended with puffs of white smoke.

Makes you wonder...

Stephen
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  #12  
Old 8th February 2020, 14:21
Dan History Dan History is offline
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Re: Rocket anti-aircraft fire

Stephen,

It would certainly be interesting to explain these observations. I would say that the real phenomenon which led to these trails and puffs of smoke is likely to be quite mundane. On the Eastern front, a 'Tiger' tank mentioned in a Soviet report was in fact a Panzer IV more often than not, and the same was the case for the even more rare 'Ferdinand' tank destroyer, which were reported destroyed by the dozens when less than a hundred were manufactured.

Regards,

Dan
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  #13  
Old 8th February 2020, 21:08
edwest2 edwest2 is offline
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Re: Rocket anti-aircraft fire

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Originally Posted by Dan History View Post
Stephen,

It would certainly be interesting to explain these observations. I would say that the real phenomenon which led to these trails and puffs of smoke is likely to be quite mundane. On the Eastern front, a 'Tiger' tank mentioned in a Soviet report was in fact a Panzer IV more often than not, and the same was the case for the even more rare 'Ferdinand' tank destroyer, which were reported destroyed by the dozens when less than a hundred were manufactured.

Regards,

Dan
Dan,

This is off topic and adds no new information. I am preparing to locate more material on German anti-aircraft rockets deployed in 1944 and 1945. More photos are coming to light of 'unknown' Luftwaffe equipment, including 'never built' items based on what has been published so far.

Regards,
Ed
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  #14  
Old 8th February 2020, 21:37
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Re: Rocket anti-aircraft fire

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Originally Posted by edwest2 View Post
Dan,

This is off topic …
Regards,
Ed
Moderator’s note: the prevalence of mistaken observations throughout the war and on all sides is clearly on-topic in considering any unexplained or anomalous occurrence. It may not always be the answer but it is certainly a possibility to be borne in mind.
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  #15  
Old 8th February 2020, 21:38
edwest2 edwest2 is offline
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Re: Rocket anti-aircraft fire

I agree Nick.

Best,
Ed
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  #16  
Old 9th February 2020, 10:10
Edward L. Hsiao Edward L. Hsiao is offline
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Post Re: Rocket anti-aircraft fire

The reports coming from the USAAF and RAF air crews about German defense measures like ground to air rockets and jet propelled fighters are very interesting indeed. I wonder if the Soviet air crews have reports about these German ground to air rocket as well? I know that the Soviets had encounters German jets fighters before.
Sincerely,

Edward L. Hsiao
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  #17  
Old 13th February 2020, 08:52
Edward L. Hsiao Edward L. Hsiao is offline
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Re: Rocket anti-aircraft fire

Was there a system that allows the Germans to fire ground to air missiles at night against RAF bombers? Sound crazy. What do you think?

Edward L. Hsiao
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  #18  
Old 13th February 2020, 09:30
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Re: Rocket anti-aircraft fire

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Originally Posted by Edward L. Hsiao View Post
Was there a system that allows the Germans to fire ground to air missiles at night against RAF bombers? Sound crazy. What do you think?

Edward L. Hsiao
Würzburg allowed them to direct AA guns at night. Open to question is whether that was sufficiently accurate to have brought a single missile, as opposed to shells from multiple guns, within lethal range. They lacked the centimetric radars that gave the Allies an embryonic blind-firing capability and nor (IIRC) did they have the proximity fuses which so enhanced the lethality of Allied AA. If, as in some of the examples cited, we are talking about early-mid 1944 then deployed German systems would probably have sufficed to aim a barrage of unguided rockets (something like the British Z-guns). They could undoubtedly have managed line-of-sight wire guidance or radio-control (the latter vulnerable to jamming) as they did in their air-to-surface weapons, or possibly infra-red.

As for a missile system, what is anyone suggesting it could have been? The progress of the various guided weapon programmes (Enzian, Wasserfall, Rheintochter etc.) is pretty well documented. Where is the captured documentation or the wartime intelligence (human, photo-reconnaissance, signals) for a system or a launch unit deployed to France in 1944? A security nightmare from the German point of view, you might think.

Also, if the Allied Command assessed the reports of rocket-Flak as a genuine threat then you'd expect P/R Mosquitoes and Spitfires to have been allover the suspected launch areas like a rash, so there should be ORBs, sortie reports and pictures.
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  #19  
Old 17th February 2020, 12:38
Edward L. Hsiao Edward L. Hsiao is offline
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Re: Rocket anti-aircraft fire

Anymore post-missions reports made by Allied bomber crewmen about surface to air rockets used by the Luftwaffe? Or how about air to air weapons used by Luftwaffe fighter planes?

Edward L. Hsiao
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