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  #101  
Old 27th January 2020, 21:50
RudiS RudiS is offline
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Re: Captured German planes, not from eBay



https://historical-media.com/id1030.htm
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  #102  
Old 14th February 2020, 13:58
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Re: Captured German planes, not from eBay

I wonder where "near Munich" this JV 44 "Weisse 7" was found... Any ideas ? Any other details known ?
https://www.newspapers.com/clip/10080071/courierpost/

Thanks in advance
Marc
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  #103  
Old 14th February 2020, 15:11
Karoband Karoband is offline
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Re: Captured German planes, not from eBay

Hi Marc,

It is probably WNr. 111704 at Bad Abling. However, Dan O'Connell also lists WNr. 111744 as a 'white 7' of JV44.

forum.12oclockhigh.net/archive/index.php?t-19676.html

Jim
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  #104  
Old 14th February 2020, 17:18
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Re: Captured German planes, not from eBay

Thanks Jim,

This nails it indeed. Much appreciated.

Cheers
Marc
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  #105  
Old 15th February 2020, 20:43
Karoband Karoband is offline
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Re: Captured German planes, not from eBay

My apologies, Marc.

Having examined the photographic evidence, I think now I have misled you.

forum.12oclockhigh.net/album.php?albumid=73&pictureid=678

The above photo was definitely taken at the dump at München-Riem. Please note that the style, colour (slightly different from the balkenkreuz) and position of the "7" viz-a-viz the balkenkreuz is identical to that in your photograph. Moreover, in the photo above, the rear portion of the fuselage can be seen lying beneath with the same truncated horizontal stabilizer.

Also, the two pictures I have of the starboard side only of WNr. 111704, show a dappled Me 262 with the "7" in a slightly lower position and either the balkenkreuz non-existant or shaded out. If anyone has views of WNr. 111704, especially the port side, verification would be greatly appreciated.

Marc, if the Me 262 in your photograph is indeed the one in the Riem dump, then the caption should be taken literally and it is not WNr. 111704.

Jim
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  #106  
Old 16th February 2020, 14:41
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Re: Captured German planes, not from eBay

Jim, thanks for your follow-up and correction; they are highly appreciated.

Archivár, over on modelforum.cz, wrote the following commentary on the same photo, uploaded by Pufo:
https://www.modelforum.cz/viewtopic....0971&start=540

This is a google.com translation:

"The "white 7" from colleague Pufo is very, very interesting. First of all - it is definitely Munich airport (according to the wooden shed in the background, the same shed can be found in another photo - see eg 25 page of this discussion). The style of the fuselage number corresponds to the numbers of JV 44 - see eg "white 3" (W.Nr.111.746), "white 5" (W.Nr.111.745) and "white 6" (W.Nr.111.740). This suggests that the aircraft could belong to the first group of twelve machines received by JV 44, for which W.Nr. "weave" around block 111.7 ..
In my opinion, it is an aircraft serial number W.Nr.111.744, which at JV 44 actually flew - see below.

It is interesting that the aircraft W.Nr.111.744 is not listed in the list of machines in Munich on April 26. 1945. But there is an aircraft W.Nr.111.074, which did not exist. It leads me to the idea that when they compiled the list, so this machine was not sure of the serial number - note that the aircraft does not have a tail (I can think of the idea that those who wrote aircraft to April 26, 1945 probably did not know the exact W.Nr. - could not read it from the tail - it was not there, so somewhere wrongly copied). The aircraft was certainly intended for repair by mechanics Luftwaffe - see the typical assembly goats and it is also towed in the anti-bomb cover.

And the last thing - there is a record that Heinz Bär flew "white 7". However, there is also "white 7" of III./EJG 2. It raises the question of which of the two aircraft "white 7" at the end of the war flew."

Cheers
Marc
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  #107  
Old 16th February 2020, 19:40
Karoband Karoband is offline
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Re: Captured German planes, not from eBay

Hi Marc,

Some comments on your latest post.

http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/album....&pictureid=679

While I could not find a photo containing a wooden shed on p. 25 of the thread in modelforum.cz, I did find this one on p. 26 which seems to show WNr. 111746 along the taxiway at Riem before the "white 3" was added. It could very well be the same shed.

I would suggest that for some reason the "white 7" in Jack Boyer's photograph was abandoned before April 26, 1945 in a bomb crater along the taxiway and the wings propped up to remove the engines. American troops would have found it in this condition and removed it to the Riem dump. This Me 262 may, indeed, be WNr. 111744 which was manufactured at Kuno I, Scheppach at the same time WNr. 111704 was being assembled at Hessental, Schwabisch Hall.

I would also suggest that the WNr. 111704 "white 7" found at Bad Abling was the replacement for this aircraft and was the one mentioned in the inventory list of April 26, 1945 as "111074".

Jim
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  #108  
Old 29th September 2020, 18:36
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Re: Captured German planes, not from eBay

Hi there Gang,

Trawling thought the USHMM collections today, I chanced on an exceptional portfolio mainly of the planes - mainly JV 44 Me 262's and NSGr. 9 Ju 87 D's and Fw 190 F - found at Innsbruck-Hötting and around Innsbruck-Reichenau made after 4 May 1945 by Efrem Ostrowski who donated in 1995 his album to the Museum.
https://collections.ushmm.org/search...%2C2596%2C1898

I would love to hear more about the the two crash-landed He 111 H's, the Fw 190 F-8 or F-9 and also the Ju 188.

Last but not least, there are also two very sharp photos of a He 219, certainly NOT taken at Innsbruck. Any ideas where ?

Cheers
Marc
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  #109  
Old 29th September 2020, 19:29
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Re: Captured German planes, not from eBay

My first thought was Ju 188 D-2, W.Nr. 290041, F6+DP of 6.(F)/122, a refugee from Italy, which David E. Brown brought to my attention. The fourth fuselage code letter is a "P" (not sure about the third letter, maybe another "P") so it's quite likely from the same Staffel but, the "old" one doesn't have exhaust flame suppressors and it's unlikely that souvenir hunters could have removed those. Nor does the photo I know seem to have the FuG 200 antenna mounted on the port side of the nose. The access ladder isn't apparent in the "old" photo although that could easily have been moved.

The "old" photo (a left rear quarter view) doesn't have any camouflage net draped around the engines and you can't see the fuel tank (or supply container?) under the port wing. Also visible in this latest picture is that the underside of the wing isn't black but the underside of the fuselage is. Note also the overpainted Balkenkreuz under the wing. The rear fuselage paint appears lighter than the "old" photo" but that could just be the angle and stronger daylight. Both this machine and the "old" one have FuG 216 tail warning antennae mounted above the wings.
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  #110  
Old 30th September 2020, 09:16
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Re: Captured German planes, not from eBay

Thanks Nick,

For pointing out the features of this machine which, if I understand you well, could be a second 6.(F)/122 refugee ?

Cheers
Marc
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