US aircraft wrack to id.

[KrisJG3]

Dear Members ,

Last time my collegue have found some details of shouted down American (?) aircraft from area of Politz (Police).
Here is some details of wrack:

https://picasaweb.google.com/1181984...MDfkZrC2JTMbA#

on the one detail is text: X-RAY (light green aluminium detail):
https://picasaweb.google.com/1181984...39701689668866

also this with a lot of serial numbers:
https://picasaweb.google.com/1181984...39219936928274

https://picasaweb.google.com/1181984...39304333442082

https://picasaweb.google.com/1181984...39743960274130

https://picasaweb.google.com/1181984...40033989424802

Plexi-glass (different thicness):

https://picasaweb.google.com/1181984...40368256974658

Please try to help us id wrack of (probably) US aircraft. Of coures we informed our collegues from friendly organization about this wrack. If we get more details we going to inform US members of Aircraft Organization - can we ask about right links / e-mails to them ?

Best regards,
Kris

PS

"..three important microwave systems: a 10 cm airborne interception radar, a 10 ..... AN/APS-6 Aircraft Radar," in Westinghouse in World War 2: Radio and X-ray ... ..."

http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/USN/...lotsManual.pdf

http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/USN/...ars/index.html

Is it above mentioned detail with text: X-RAY from Night Fighter ? See this part:

https://picasaweb.google.com/1181984...39647298931314
https://picasaweb.google.com/1181984...39692040142546

See this: http://www.mossie.org/stories/Norman_Malayney_2.htm

" .... Lt. Richard Geary flew the 21 January mission to the Politz Oil Refinery at Stettin, Poland with Lt. Floyd Mann as navigator.
They had been on standby for this particular mission waiting for the weather to clear. The operations room had an enormous map that covered 25 feet or better of one wall. The missions for the day, the next day or when weather permitted, were represented by colored yarn. A different color for each mission was stretched from Watton to the target area. The yarn for the Politz mission went all the way from one end of the map to the other. Geary recalls aircrew members asking, 'Who the hell is going to fly that mission?'
It was a cold winter morning when an orderly awakened Geary at 0400. The weather had cleared and the mission proceeded as scheduled. Geary went to the flight line and then to the parachute room to meet his navigator Floyd Mann.
Watton was covered with a thin layer of snow as they took off at 0920 in NS569. Prior arrangements were made to rendezvous at 0925 with four P-51s from 20th FG at 18,000 feet over Cromer. They would provide escort to Stettin and return. ..... " (more at link above- source)


P51 Mustang:
http://www.simviation.com/yabbupload...02oldcrow1.jpg

Mustang P51 was also equiped at Browing ammo like this one - but please confirm type of aircraft on base attached pictures.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_A...n_P-51_Mustang

[KrisJG3]

Here is from Internet list of hitted by Luftwaffe aircrafts araund Stettin/Politz and Pommeren area (there are also 2x Mustang P-51 in "green"):

1943

21 Apr 1943 Werner Hoffmann 4./NJG 5 Halifax 4000m 00:45 15km E Eggesin

21 Apr 1943 Werner Hoffmann 4./NJG 5 Halifax 500m 00:50 500m S Gut-Borkum



1944

06 Jan 1944 Kurt Welter 5./JG 302 4-mot. Flzg. 03:46 West of von Stettin

06 Jan 1944 Kurt Welter 5./JG 302 4-mot. Flzg. 04:11 West of von Stettin

06 Jan 1944 Andreas Hartl 6./JG 302 Lancaster 03:41 West of von Stettin

06 Jan 1944 Josef Kraft 4.NJG 5 Lancaster 04:01 NW Stettin

06 Jan 1944 Paul Zorner 8.NJG 3 Lancaster 03:42 NW Stettin

06 Jan 1944 Josef Kraft 4.NJG 5 Lancaster 03:33 Stettin

06 Jan 1944 Paul Zorner 8.NJG 3 Lancaster 03:51 NW Stettin

06 Jan 1944 Josef Kraft 4.NJG 5 Lancaster 03:45 NW Stettin

06 Jan 1944 Hermann Stock 12.NJG 3 Lancaster 04:15 NW Stettin





1 1 Apr 1944 Schinner 8./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 4400m 11:50 See Stettin

11 Apr 1944 Nagel 7./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 4500m 11:55 Kammin

11 Apr 1944 Buschen 5./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 4500m 11:55 SK Ostee (N Kolberg)

11 Apr 1944 Rudi Dassow Stab II./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 4500m 11:50-55 SK Ostee (N Kolberg) 1150-

11 Apr 1944 Kicherer 4./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 4300m 12:00 SL (80km NNW Kolberg)

11 Apr 1944 Steinmann 4./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 45-5000m 12:00 SK-SL (50km NW Kolberg)

11 Apr 1944 Rudi Dassow 4./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 4500m 12:05 TK (sea N Kammin)

11 Apr 1944 Schubert 9./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 4500m 12:10 30km N Kammin

11 Apr 1944 von Glasenapp 4./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 4500m 12:15 TL (sea NW Kolberg) 1200-

11 Apr 1944 Fros 5./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 1500m 12:40 Pyritz (ssE Stettin)

11 Apr 1944 Labe 8./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 2500-20m 12:20 Greifenberg

11 Apr 1944 Paris 7./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 4500m 12:10-20 Kammin

11 Apr 1944 Helmut Paris 7./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 4400m 12:10-20 Kammin

11 Apr 1944 Buschen 5./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 4500m 11:55 SK Ostee (N. Kolberg)

11 Apr 1944 Georg Nagel 7./ZG26 B-17 HSS 6000m 11:55 Kammin

11 Apr 1944 Labe 8./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 2500-20m 12:20 Greifenberg 2500-20m

11 Apr 1944 Walter Kicherer 4./ZG26 B-17 HSS 4300m 12:00 SL (80km NNW Kolberg)

11 Apr 1944 Wilhelm Fros 5./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 1500m 12:40 Pyritz (SSE Stettin)

11 Apr 1944 Schinner 8./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 4400m 11:50 See Stettin

11 Apr 1944 Schubert 9./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 4500m 12:10 30km N. Kammin

11 Apr 1944 Steinmann 4./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 4.5-5000m 12:00 SK-SL 4.5-5000m (50km NW Kolberg)

11 Apr 1944 Wedige von Glasenapp 4./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 12:00-15 TL (see NW Kolberg)



29 May 1944 Fridolin Reinartz 4./JG 3 B-24 Liberator 6500m 12:20 AK-AI (Swinemunde 090˚)

29 May 1944 Feingen 6./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 6000m 12:20-30 South of Wollin

29 May 1944 Kudozus 5./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 6000m 12:20-25 Stettiner-Bucht

29 May 1944 Gabel 3./JG 1 P-51 Mustang 3000m 12:25-30 JB-JC-KB-KC (Quedlingburg)

29 May 1944 Hans Grunberg 5./JG 3 B-24 Liberator 6500m 12:27 BI 3/BK 1 (N Stettin)

29 May 1944 Walter Agricola 5./JG 3 B-24 Liberator 6500m 12:27 AK 7 Wollin

29 May 1944 Borkert 2./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 12:30-40 AK Wollin

29 May 1944 Wesske 3./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 6000m 12:30-40 AK-AJ (Swinemunde)

29 May 1944 Proff 4./JG 1 B-17 Fortress 7500m 12:35 Raum Gorlitz

29 May 1944 Georg Strobele 8./JG 3 B-17 Fortress 7000m 12:20 Pretzsch

29 May 1944 Herbert Zillmer 9./JG 3 B-17 Fortress Hss 7000m 12:13 Wittenberge

29 May 1944 Raab 2./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 6000m 12:30-45 AK-UK (Kammin area)

29 May 1944 Kessels 1./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 6000m 12:30-40 UK-AK (Kammin area)

29 May 1944 Walter Becker 6./JG 3 B-24 Liberator 6500m 12:20 BK Wollin

29 May 1944 Raab 2./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 6000m 12:30-45 AK-UK (Kammin area)

29 May 1944 Kessels 1./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 6000m 12:30-40 UK-AK (Kammin area)

29 May 1944 Walter Becker 6./JG 3 B-24 Liberator 6500m 12:20 BK Wollin

29 May 1944 Herwig Befeldt 8./JG 3 B-17 Fortress 7000m 12:20 SE Pretzsch

29 May 1944 Karl-Heinz Rave 8./JG 3 B-17 Fortress Hss 7000m 12:20 SE Pretzsch

29 May 1944 Buchholz 2./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 4500m 12:30 TI 5-6 (Pommersche-Bucht)

29 May 1944 Jemtz 2./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 6000m 12:18-30 BK-AK (Golnow-Wollin)

29 May 1944 Herbert Rollwage 5./JG 53 B-17 Fortress 6800m 12:06 JE-JF Dessau

29 May 1944 von Glasenapp 4./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 5500m 12:15-30 N Wollin

29 May 1944 Erich Schauer 8./JG 3 B-17 Fortress Hss

29 May 1944 Schulz 2./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 6000m 12:10-25 TJ-TK (Pommersche-Bucht)

29 May 1944 Walter Enser 9./JG 54 B-17 Fortress 10m 15:42 TN1/SM 9 (Baltic off Kolberg)

29 May 1944 Lutz-Wilhelm Burkhardt 7./JG 11 P-47 Thunderbolt

29 May 1944 Pingel 2./ZG26 P-51 Mustang 800m 14:00-15 AK (Wollin)

29 May 1944 Rudi Dassow 4./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 7500m 13:30 15 Ost/RK (SW Bornholm)

29 May 1944 Kicherer 4./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 6000m 13:00-20 RK-RJ (Baltic SW Bornholm)

29 May 1944 Theves 1./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 6000m 13:00 AK 1-2-4-5 (Wollin)

29 May 1944 Bange 1./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 6000m 14:45-55 TK See (Pommersche-Bucht)

29 May 1944 Rentz 9./JG 11 B-24 Liberator Hss 6500m 11:51 AH Anklam

29 May 1944 Kredel 3./JG 11 B-17 Fortress 6500m 11:40 15 Ost S/AF-AG (Raum Anklam)

29 May 1944 Feingen 6./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 12:20-30 S. Wollin

29 May 1944 Buchholz 2./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 4500m 12:30 TI 5-6 (Pommersche-Bucht)

29 May 1944 Hans Grunberg 5./JG 3 B-24 Liberator 12:27 BI 3/BK 1 (N. Stettin)

29 May 1944 Bange 1./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 6000m 14:45-55 TK See (Pommersche-Bucht)

29 May 1944 Hans Kessels 1./ZG26 B-24 HSS 100m 12:30-40 UK-AK (Raum Kammin)

29 May 1944 Gunther Borkert 2./ZG26 B-24 HSS 12:30-40 AK (Wollin)

29 May 1944 Hans Raab 2./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 4000m 12:30-45 AK-UK (Raum Kammin)

29 May 1944 Walter Kicherer 4./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 6000m 13:00-20 RK-RJ (Baltic SW Bornholm)

29 May 1944 Weiss 1./JG 11 B-17 Fortress 6000m 11:40 AF-AG (Raum Anklam)

29 May 1944 Wick 5./JG 11 P-51 Mustang 7900m 12:05-10 AE-BE-BF (Teterow-Malchin)

29 May 1944 Wesske 3./ZG26 B-24 HSS 6000m 12:30-40 AK-AJ (Swinemunde)

29 May 1944 Wedige von Glasenapp 4./ZG26 B-24 HSS 5500m 12:15-30 N. Wollin

29 May 1944 Rentz 9./JG 11 B-24 HSS 6500m 11:51 AH (Anklam)

29 May 1944 Kudozus 5./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 6000m 12:20-25 Stettiner-Bucht

29 May 1944 Pingel 2./ZG26 P-51 Mustang 800m 14:00-15 AK (Wollin)

29 May 1944 Theves 1./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 6000m 13:00 AK 1-2-4-5 (Wollin)

29 May 1944 Jemtz 2./ZG26 B-24 Liberator 6000m 12:18-30 BK-AK (Golnow-Wollin)

29 May 1944 Kredel 3./JG 11 B-17 Fortress 6500m 11:40 15 Ost S/AF-AG (Raum Anklam)



20 Jun 1944 Kurt Gabler 8./JG 300 P-51 Mustang 3000m 09:33 Stettin

20 Jun 1944 Eiselt 8./JG 300 P-51 Mustang 7000m 10:26 Pasewalk



21 Jun 1944 Aretz 6./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 8000m 09:30 BJ-8 (50km NW Stettin)

21 Jun 1944 Hermannn 1./ZG26 B-17 Fortress Hss 7800m 09:35 AG (Tutow)

21 Jun 1944 Kobert 9./JG 300 B-17 Fortress 6500-7500m 09:40 Pasewalk

21 Jun 1944 Bernhard 7./JG 300 B-17 Fortress 1300m 10:01 Prenzlau

21 Jun 1944 Aretz 6./ZG26 B-17 Fortress 8000m 09:30 BJ 8 (50km NW Stettin)

21 Jun 1944 Kobert 9./JG 300 B-17 Fortress 6500-7500m 09:40 Pasewalk


06 Aug 1944 Willi Glitz Stab II./NJG 2 Mosquito 1500m 03:40 BJ-BI ???


24 Aug 1944 Ortwin Pfundner 5./JG 27 P-51 Mustang 3000m 12:45 BK-56 (N. Stettin)???



30 Aug 1944 Scholl Eins./St./NJG 102 Lancaster 01:55 E. Stettin

30 Aug 1944 Rudolf Altendorf Stab IV./NJG 5 Lancaster 3000m 01:59 BJ-1 ???

30 Aug 1944 Kurt Welter 10./JG 300 Lancaster 4800m 02:05 CJ-BJ

30 Aug 1944 Kurt Welter 10./JG 300 Lancaster 4800m 02:10 BJ-CJ

30 Aug 1944 Kurt Welter 10./JG 300 Lancaster 4800m 02:12 BJ-CJ

30 Aug 1944 Kurt Welter 10./JG 300 Lancaster 4800m 02:15 BJ-CJ

30 Aug 1944 Rudolf Altendorff Stab IV./NJG 5 Lancaster 3000m 01:59 BJ-1 ???

30 Aug 1944 Otto Hiller 12./NJG 5 4-mot. Flzg. 3000m 01:58 BB-1 ???

30 Aug 1944 Scholl Eins./St./NJG 102 Lancaster 01:55 ostw Stettin



1945

07 Feb 1945 Herbert Altner 8./NJG5 Halifax Stettin

07 Feb 1945 Herbert Altner 8./NJG5 Halifax Stettin

07 Feb 1945 Herbert Altner 8./NJG5 Halifax Stettin

07 Feb 1945 Heinz Bocksteigel 10./NJG11 Lancaster

08 Feb 1945 Ernst-Georg Drunkler Stab I./NJG5 Lancaster 21:08 SW Stettin

08 Feb 1945 Rudolf Mangelsdorf Stab III./NJG2 Lancaster 22:03

08 Feb 1945 Walter Borchers Stab./NJG 5 Lancaster

08 Feb 1945 Ernst-Georg Drunkler Stab I./NJG5 Lancaster 21:03 SW Stettin

08 Feb 1945 Ernst-Georg Drunkler Stab I./NJG5 Lancaster 21:12 S. Stettiner Hafen

19 Feb 1945 Willi Unger 15./JG 3 P-39 Aircobra 13:18 7km E. Stargard

08 Mar 1945 unknown Stab III./JG 11 Yak-9 11:25 15 Ost S/4464 [Raum Stettin]

08 Mar 1945 unknown Stab III./JG 11 Yak-9 w.b. 11:25 15 Ost S/4464 [Raum Stettin]

08 Mar 1945 unknown Stab III./JG 11 Yak-9 w.b. 11:25 15 Ost S/4464 [Raum Stettin]

15 Mar 1945 Willi Unger 15./JG 3 Pe-2 13:58 Raum Griefenberg

15 Mar 1945 Willi Unger 15./JG 3 Pe-2 13:55 Raum Griefenberg

24 Apr 1945 Willi Desinger Stab III./EJG1 Yak-3 14:45 5km NE Gaxxxx [S. Stettin]

25 Apr 1945 Willi Desinger Stab III./EJG1 Yak-3 18:40 8km S. Stettin

26 Apr 1945 Willi Desinger Stab III./EJG1 Yak-3 11:45 5km N. xxxxxx [S. Stettin]

Source: http://www.forum.modelarstwo.org.pl/...p?f=87&t=49145

Please on base attached above photos please try to id wrack of aircraft (is it P-51 Mustang - escort fighter?).


It seems to me rudder pedal from photo is not in colour US but Luftwaffe - is it true, see:
https://picasaweb.google.com/1181984...39566963597266
https://picasaweb.google.com/1181984...39556093401874

?

Very interesting - German Luftwaffe also have some captured P-51 Mustangs:
http://www.mustang.gaetanmarie.com/a...ny/germany.htm

See Manual for P-51 Mustang:

http://books.google.pl/books?id=Sfwq...page&q&f=false

and compare photo from COCPIT with this gummi material:
https://picasaweb.google.com/1181984...38803026582914

[Alan Clark]

A lot of those parts carry stamps associated with Douglas. The inked elongate D with numbers inside and the strange B with the 1111 in it are Douglas stamps. I've seen both at sites in the UK and they are also on Craig Fuller's list of US stamps.

As for aircraft type, it could be C-47, A-20 (or Boston / Havoc in UK or Russian colours) or B-24 (they built a lot under contract) or anything else which came from Douglas plants.

[KrisJG3]

Thanks Alan for answer. Maybe somebody has additional info. for us ?

We will try to get more details of wrack and prepare new pictures - but it take more time.

Best regards,

Kris

[FrankieS]

maybe one of them?

9756 441007 B-17 44-6145 Cover Girl 401 614 H. P. Silverstein
9757 441007 B-17 42-31081 Son of Blitz 401 613 A. J. Nelson
9760 441007 B-17 42-107084 Betty's Revenge 401 614 Harasym A

[KrisJG3]

Originally Posted by FrankieS

maybe one of them?

1) 9756 441007 B-17 44-6145 Cover Girl 401 614 H. P. Silverstein
2) 9757 441007 B-17 42-31081 Son of Blitz 401 613 A. J. Nelson
3) 9760 441007 B-17 42-107084 Betty's Revenge 401 614 Harasym A

Flak on the bomb run from Stettin to Politz was intense and accurate. As a result the 401st lost five aircraft, and the Wing lost 17 of the 142 aircraft which attacked Politz.
The aircraft shot down were the following:
No 42-107084 ("Betty's Revenge") piloted by Lt. A. Harasym, received a direct hit in the navigator's compartment, killing the bombardier and navigator. One other crew member was killed when he left the plane without a parachute. The others parachuted safely and were made POW's.
http://www.401bg.org/history/aircraft.asp?acid=107084 ---> Manufacturer: Douglas Aircraft, Long Beach, California
No. 44-6145 ("Cover Girl"), piloted by Lt. H. P. Silverstein, blew up in mid-air after being hit by flak. Two crew members were thrown clear and parachuted safely but the others were killed in action.
http://www.401bg.org/history/aircraft.asp?acid=6145 ---> Manufacturer: Douglas Aircraft, Long Beach, California , Note: http://401bg.org/forum/show_msg.asp?ID=606
No.42-31081 ("Son of Blitz"), piloted by Lt. A. J. Nelson, received a direct hit that blew off the nose of the aircraft, which then went into a vertical dive. None of the crew survived.
http://www.401bg.org/history/aircraft.asp?acid=31081 ---> Manufacturer: Boeing Aircraft Company, Seattle, Washington , Note: http://www.preller.us/MightyEighthMe...ges/61456.html

So this last probably not ?

Source: http://www.401bg.org/history/mission_sum.asp?mid=154

Photos some of them:

Front to back:
42-107151: B-17G-35-DL. IW-B "Cover Girl", assigned 401BG 15 April 44.
x
x
42-107084: B-17G-35-DL. IW-G "Betty's Revenge", assigned 401BG 16 April 44.

http://www.401stforum.com/forumhome/....php?f=1&t=508

But we are not 100% sure of course - how to check it ?

[KrisJG3]

Next details and parts from the same wrack will be soon.

On one small pipe was text: HAMILTON BEACH , another detail from wrack - big pice of black rubber with text: INSIDE NEXT TO FUEL https://picasaweb.google.com/1181984...52931600568914
We have a lot of new parts but first we have to washe them and next make a lot of photos for better id.

Finally we would like to agree type of aircraft and (maybe if it will be possible list of crew members).

Best regards,

KrisJG3


Some US Air Force reports about missions over Politz:

1. ↑ Charles McGrew: USAAF Chronology - April, 1944 (ang.). ---> See date: 11.04.1944 -> 52 pcs - Boeing B-17 Flying Fortress -> US Air Force
2. ↑ Charles McGrew: USAAF Chronology - Maj, 1944 (ang.). ---> See date: 29.05.1944 -> 224 pcs B-24 -> US Air Force ---> see: May 29, 1944 Mission #6 Politz : http://valortovictory.tripod.com/1944-05.html http://www.luftwaffe.cz/grunberg.html (Grunberg- He claimed his 70th victory on 29 May, when he shot down a USAAF B-17 ??? four-engine bomber near Stettin.) ; See Mission nr. 63: http://tinpan.fortunecity.com/aprils.../missions.html
   
3. ↑ 29 May 1944 Mission #95 Target: Politz (ang.). B24.NET. ---> See date: 29.05.1944 -> 224 pcs B-24 -> US Air Force
4. ↑ Charles McGrew: USAAF Chronology - June, 1944 (ang.). ---> See date: 20.06.1944 -> 245 pcs B-24 -> US Air Force
5. ↑ 20 June 1944 - Missions #116 & #117 - Targets: Politz & Crepy
   
6. ↑ Charles McGrew: USAAF Chronology - August, 1944 (ang.). ---> See date: 25.06.1944 -> 169 pcs Boeing B-17 Flying Fortress -> US Air Force
7. ↑ Charles McGrew: USAAF Chronology - October, 1944 (ang.). ---> See date: 07.10.1944 -> 142 pcs Boeing B-17 Flying Fortress -> US Air Force ---> http://www.cloudnet.com/~jfb/

B17 - hitted during mission over Politz:

"... Boeing B-17 Flying Fortress "Battlin' Betty"
Vega B-17G-1-VE Flying Fortress
s/n 42-39847
614th BS, 401st BG, 8th AF
Shot down by flak and fighters on the April 11,1944 mission to bomb the synthetic oil refinery ( Hydrierwerke) at Politz/Sorau. The entire crew became POW's
The crew on her last mission:
2ndLt. F.L. Shaw - pilot
2ndLt. W.R. Cole - copilot
2ndLt. E.W. Engelhardt - navigator
2ndLt. A.L. Autrey - bombardier
S/Sgt. K.A. Terroux - radio operator
T/Sgt. R.W. Macomber - engineer/top turret gunner
Sgt. R.O. Hurd - ball turret gunner
S/Sgt. H.A. Highlen - tail gunner
S/Sgt. R.T. Gordon - waist gunner
S/Sgt. C.K. Seagren - waist gunner ..."

See photo: http://www.flickr.com/photos/18532986@N07/4509561315/

[KrisJG3]

Dears,

We have found this photo with B-17 Ball Turret interior:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/miskypi...n/photostream/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/miskypi...ream/lightbox/

here is shown our "pedal", look:

https://picasaweb.google.com/1181984...39148581962578

Here is shown black gumi/rubber with connection- we have it, too:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/miskypi...ream/lightbox/

by the way we have a lot of pices from this Ball Turret interior !!!
So first we have: B17 , now we would like to agree name of aircraft and crew members.
Please help if You can .

Best regards,

Kris

PS- answer probably is here:
Some US Air Force reports about missions over Politz:

1. ↑ Charles McGrew: USAAF Chronology - April, 1944 (ang.). ---> See date: 11.04.1944 -> 52 pcs - Boeing B-17 Flying Fortress -> US Air Force
2. ↑ Charles McGrew: USAAF Chronology - August, 1944 (ang.). ---> See date: 25.06.1944 -> 169 pcs Boeing B-17 Flying Fortress -> US Air Force
3. ↑ Charles McGrew: USAAF Chronology - October, 1944 (ang.). ---> See date: 07.10.1944 -> 142 pcs Boeing B-17 Flying Fortress -> US Air Force

"...Oct. 7, 1944:We Bombed Politz Today. All Three Ships In The Lead Element Were Shot Down Over The Target. Colonel Luper, Our Group Commander Was Lost. I Think Two Men Got Out Of His Plane. We Were Hit Over Fifty Times, Holes Everywhere. Every Direction I Looked Flak Was Bursting. I Must Have Prayed Out Loud. I Could Smell The Flak Through My Oxygen Mask. I Was Sweating Even At 40 Degrees Below Zero. The Ship Flying On Our Left Wing Got A Direct Hit In The Nose. It Almost Crashed Into Us Out Of Control. One Man's Body Was Hanging Half Way Out Of What Was Left Of The Nose, Most Of His Clothes Blasted Off. In The Ball I Was Practically Looking The Bursts In The Face As They Tracked Us Along And Kept Exploding Right Under Me... ..."


Source: http://www.cloudnet.com/~jfb/

Books:

http://books.google.pl/books?id=SQnM...Politz&f=false

http://books.google.pl/books?id=82LF...page&q&f=false

----------------------------------------------

[KrisJG3]

New additional details from place where was crashed aircraft (B-17 ?):

https://picasaweb.google.com/1181984...q5y_yW-JT71QE#

Please help at id some parts of wrack.

"Red" handle: https://picasaweb.google.com/1181984...55686022693682

"Brown" wheel: https://picasaweb.google.com/1181984...53641527387970

Do you know who have access to catollgues with parts, code, manufactures of parts to B-17 ?

[KrisJG3]

Here is a lot of details from inside of B-17:
http://www.air-and-space.com/200705%...s%20static.htm



Please see B-17 inside also here:

CLICK HERE TO SEE AMAZING SPHERICAL PANORAMA IMAGES OF THE B-17.

http://www.collingsfoundation.org/tour_b-17g.htm

If somebody need to fly at the B17 - it is possible , have a look:

http://www.collingsfoundation.org/cf...xperiences.htm

B-17 Flights - 30 Min. experience
$xxx per person
(min 6 passengers / max 10 passengers)

This details have found on attached photos:

https://picasaweb.google.com/1181984...55570229742466

https://picasaweb.google.com/1181984...40033989424802