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Old 11th July 2012, 08:51
Larry Hickey Larry Hickey is offline
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Need help with Leadership lists for KG30

Hello,

I'd like to begin working through a full leadership roster for KG30 for the period 1939-40. I'm in pretty good shape at the Gesch and Gr levels, but still have a lot of gaps at the StaKap level.

The first task at the Staffel level in doing a comprehensive StaKa list for I./KG30 is to determine the first person in each of the three Staffeln to have that job, then who succeeded them.

Right now I believe as follows:

1 Staffel:

a) Hptm Siegmund Strop: 26.9.39 – 16.10.39 (PoW Scotland SD by Spitfire). Did anyone hold that job briefly before Storp took it over?
b) I don't know who succeeded him, but until about 15.5.40, when
c) Hptm Heinrich Lau 15.05.40 – 9.40 (trfed out) held the position.
d) He was followed through the end of 1940 by Oblt – Hptm Siegmund-Ulrich, Freiherr von Gravenreuth: 23.9.40 – 31-12-40 (Continuing); RK 24.11.40.

2 Staffel:
a) Hptm Heinz-Wilhelm Rosenthal was StaKap by 17.10.39 and continued until 3.2.40; (MIA SD AA Scotland). He may have held that position all the way back to the unit's formation, or someone else may have preceded him for a short while.
b) Then I don't know who was StaKap to the end of the year after Rosenthal was shot down at the beginning of Feb., 1940.

3 Staffel:
a) Oblt - Hptm Arved Crüger 16.9.39 – 22.6.40; RK 14.6.40 (trfd out)
b) Don't know who succeeded him to the end of the year.

Can anyone help fill in the missing data here? Please cite sources. We'll tackle II and III Gruppe with subsequent posts.

Regards,
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Old 11th July 2012, 12:56
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udf_00 udf_00 is offline
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Re: Need help with Leadership lists for KG30

From Luftwaffe Officer Career Summaries by Henry L. deZeng IV and Douglas G. Stankey

HIELSCHER, Karl Ferdinand 16.05.40 Oblt. and Staka 2./KG 30 ...
LOESCH, Egbert von ... 16.05.40 Hptm. and Staka 1./KG 30...
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Old 11th July 2012, 15:14
Larry Hickey Larry Hickey is offline
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Re: Need help with Leadership lists for KG30

udf_00,

Thanx for teasing these two out of the LOCS DB by deZeng and Stankey. Although there are inevitable errors and conflicts in this massive data base, this is going to be a true treasure trove of information as we try to create a complete and accurate leadership roster for the EoE Project for all the Luftwaffe combat and combat support units through the end of 1940. We all owe them a great debut for the years of dedicated work required to compile such a monster, and secondly for having the generosity of posting it on-line for all to benefit from their tremendous effort and dedication.

Regards,
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Old 11th July 2012, 19:16
Larry Hickey Larry Hickey is offline
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Re: Need help with Leadership lists for KG30

Hello,

Am getting some useful feedback directly by email about this request. One issue that has been confusing things is that there were apparently two "Storps" who were early StaKap in KG30.

Quoting from the Luft Off Career Summary DB:

1) "STORP, Siegmund. 26.09.39 Oblt. and Staka 1./KG 30, POW - intercepted by Spitfires during an attack on ships at the Firth of Forth. 01.01.40 promo to Hptm."

2) "STORP, Walter (August-Franz Walter STORP). (DOB: 02.02.10 in Schnecken/Kreis Elchneiderung in Ost Preussen)....Mid-09.39 appt Führer of Erprobungsstaffel Ju 88. 01.01.40 appt Staka in KG 30. 01.03.40 appt Staka 8./KG 4..."

What I need to know is to which Staffel of KG30 "Walter" Storp was assigned. It would appear that whichever one it was, he was assigned from 1.1.30 to 1.3.40 when he was transferred out.

Not related to the KG30 problem, but of high interest about Walter Storp: "03.06.40 Hptm., Staka 8./KG 4, WIA - hit a balloon cable during a night sortie over Le Havre and belly landed at Amsterdam-Schiphol; sent to Wilhelmina Hospital in Amsterdam." Is anyone aware of any photos of this a/c after the FL?

Regards,
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Old 11th July 2012, 19:39
Larry Hickey Larry Hickey is offline
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Re: Need help with Leadership lists for KG30

Hello,

Entires in the LOCS Db regarding Oblt. Heinrich Lau and Hptm. Egbert von Loesch seems to work out part of the gap between the shootdown of Oblt. Siegmund Storp on 16.10.39 and Olbt. Lau as StaKap for 1 Staffel on 15.5.40.

Under Lau we have: "12.12.39 Oblt., trf to II./KG 30. 01.02.40 promo to Hptm. 15.05.40 appt Staka 1./KG 30. 09.40 appt Kdr. I./KG 30 (to 06.42). 24.09.40 badly injured in an auto accident, spending months in hospital. c.10.40 Hptm., appt Kdr. I./KG 30 (to 07.41?).

Under von Loesch we have "01.12.39 Hptm., in I./Lehrgruppe Ju 88. 16.05.40 Hptm. and Staka 1./KG 30, KIA, - shot down by AA fire during attack on roads W of Brussels; crashed E of Ramsdonk."

There is a one day overlap between the entries of Lau and von Loesch. However, we don't really know when v. Loesch took command of 1 Staffel. He could have immediately followed Storp, or there could have been someone else in between them. Can anybody help resolve this? Closing that gap would give us the 1 Staffel Kap complete for the entire 16 month period in question.

Two further questions,

a) does anyone have a more precise date that "@10.40" for when Lau became the I./KG30 GrKdr?

b) does anyone know what position v. Loesch held with the Gruppenstab of I./KG30, if he wasn't serving as StaKap of 1 Staffel in late 1939? I'm looking for the Adj., 1a and TO position assignments, as well as the C.O.s.

c) Given the note about Hptm. Lau being in the hospital for many months just after being promoted to I./KG30 Gr.Kdr., does anyone know who served as Acting GrKdr during his long absence? Probably one of the StaKap? Does anybody know?

Keep the info coming. We're getting there.

Regards,
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Old 11th July 2012, 19:50
Larry Hickey Larry Hickey is offline
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Re: Need help with Leadership lists for KG30

Hello,

Regarding the StaKap succession for 2./KG30 in early 1940, it appears likely that
"HIELSCHER, Karl-Ferdinand. 16.05.40 Oblt. and Staka 2./KG 30, reported missing while attacking ports in Holland and/or N France and believed to have been captured," could fill the next position after the loss (MIA) of Hptm. Rosenthal on 3.2.40. This certainly appears likely.

My questions:

a) Is there evidence that HIELSCHER did assume command of 2 Staffel directly after the loss of Rosenthal?

b) If he did, who then followed Hielscher after he went MIA on 16.5.40?

c) Regardless of who it was, I'll need to document any other 2 StaKap to the end of 1940, so info on anyone else in that position during that period would be appreciated.

Regarding 3 Staffel, we still need to know who the StaKaps were for the last 6 months of 1940.

We also need to know who the StaKaps of the Stabstaffel of I./KG30 were during the 1939-40 period.

Good progress.

Regards,
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Old 11th July 2012, 22:34
Pieter H Pieter H is offline
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Re: Need help with Leadership lists for KG30

Hi Larry,

On Hielscher, this is what Peter Cornwell says (with small corrections):

2./KG30 Junkers Ju88A-1. Hit by ground-fire during attack on roads west of Brussels and crashed and burned out near Ernage, south of Gembloux, 12.00 p.m. BS Uffz Stefan Sempert killed, BF Uffz Waldemar Gramse badly wounded – died next day, BO Oberfw Hermann Strohmaier badly wounded and FF Hptmn Karl Hielscher (Staffelkapitän) slightly wounded – both returned later. Aircraft 100% write-off.

On May 16 Gembloux was in German hands, and Hielscher likely returned to his unit. The question is then if he continued his StaKa command of 2./KG30, or that someone else took over (temporarily).

Regards, Pieter

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Old 12th July 2012, 09:33
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Re: Need help with Leadership lists for KG30

I have 2 photos of a Ju 88 crash landed at Amsterdam in jun 40 but whether it is Storp's is another matter
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Old 12th July 2012, 14:35
Larry Hickey Larry Hickey is offline
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Re: Need help with Leadership lists for KG30

Pieter,

Thanx for your insightful comment about Hielscher. At present I don't know the answer to this, but I'll wager that we'll know before we're done with this research.

Can anyone help answer this question?

Regards,
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Old 12th July 2012, 19:25
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Re: Need help with Leadership lists for KG30

For 16 May 40, NVM says Von Loesch (St Kap 1) was killed and that Hielscher (St Kap 2) was lightly wounded and returned 23 Jun 40. Of interest his EKM was 62743/1 whilst Loesch was 62758/181
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