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Old 28th December 2009, 19:24
Andy Mitchell's Avatar
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Valence airfield

In the Air 20/40 decripts there is reference to the following:-

"10 Jun 1944 - (Valence to ARC 3/XIII) that protection of the A/F cannot be guaranteed if 2 pns Flak removed, in view present patriot situation." (Ultra T.212/7)

I have two questions:-

(a) Valence - is anyone able to identify which Fliegerhorst-Kommandantur or Flugplatzkommando was responsible for Valence airfield in June 1944. I have checked Holm and cannot find reference to Valence other than for KG 26 and LLG 1 and leichte Flak-Abteilung 741 (v).
leichte Flak-Abteilung 741 (v) is recorded as being at Valence at this time and is noted as being controlled by Flak-Brigade 5 from Aug 1944.

(b) pns - anyone have a clue what this means..........

Last edited by Andy Mitchell; 28th December 2009 at 19:30. Reason: Missed reference to T.212/7
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Old 28th December 2009, 19:28
Andy Saunders Andy Saunders is offline
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Re: Valence airfield

Could that be 2 cms flak? A typo possibly?
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Old 28th December 2009, 19:52
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Re: Valence airfield

Andy,

Thanks for the quick response and your suggestion. Quite possibly, as 2 cm flak would be very useful in an anti-personnel role.

Many thanks
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Old 28th December 2009, 20:48
Larry deZeng Larry deZeng is offline
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Re: Valence airfield

Quote:
(a) Valence - is anyone able to identify which Fliegerhorst-Kommandantur or Flugplatzkommando was responsible for Valence airfield in June 1944. I have checked Holm and cannot find reference to Valence other than for KG 26 and LLG 1 and leichte Flak-Abteilung 741 (v).
According to Air Ministry A.I.3. (E)/D. of I.(O) document of 30.6.44, "G.A.F. Airfield Organization as at 28.6.44", on page 7 of 18, Valence is shown as "Airfield Detachment Valence" under A.R.C. 3/XIII Lyons. A German document found in NARA WashDC, RG 242, Microcopy T-971 roll 18/frame 072ff that gives all of the airfield commands under Feld-Luftgaukdo. Westfrankreich as of 1.7.44 shows Valence as a Flugplatzkdo. belonging to Fl.H.Kdtr. E(v) 221/XII (Lyon-Bron).

So there you have it. Across German-occupied Europe, there were many hundreds of airfields, airstrips, landing grounds and related that were too little-used to warrant and justify a full-blown Fliegerhorstkommandantur, so these were designated as unnumbered Flugplatzkommandos and subordinated to the nearest Fliegerhorstkommandantur. Some Fliegerhorstkommandanturen had 3 or 4 of them. They had a much smaller personnel and equipment complement and were usually commanded by a Oberleutnant or a Hauptmann. And such was the case for Valence.

Larry
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Old 28th December 2009, 21:57
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Re: Valence airfield

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy Mitchell View Post
In the Air 20/40 decripts there is reference to the following:-

(b) pns - anyone have a clue what this means..........
Platoons (= Flakzüge)?

If in Allied documents see references to La Trésorerie, that's Valence, too.
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Last edited by Nick Beale; 28th December 2009 at 22:02. Reason: Afterthought
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Old 28th December 2009, 22:01
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Re: Valence airfield

Valence is a town in France grossly 200 km South of Lyon, airport used before nd during the landing in Provence in august , used also as park/Feldwerkstatt, many planes hv been found there abandonned, Ju88..

Remi
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Old 28th December 2009, 22:55
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Re: Valence airfield

Guys,

Larry, Remi, and Nick - many thanks for your insights and information this helps greatly in trying to understand some of these decript summaries.

Nick - thanks for that. I have now found reference to Valence la Trésorerie in the following page http://natureonline.com/37/55-ap3-timeline.html - look for the entry of 8-15-44.

Remi - thank you for the additional information regarding Valence.

Larry - so much information, many thanks for the detail on the Flugplatzkommando and its controlling Fliegerhorstkommandantur.
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Old 28th December 2009, 23:27
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Re: Valence airfield

Here is another link to the Service Timeline of James J. MacIsaac RCAF - http://natureonline.com/37/15-op5.html - this relates specifically to the attack on Valence la Trésorerie. On reading this it appears that the attack was somewhat inaccurate.
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Old 29th December 2009, 00:04
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Re: Valence airfield

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy Mitchell View Post
Here is another link to the Service Timeline of James J. MacIsaac RCAF - http://natureonline.com/37/15-op5.html - this relates specifically to the attack on Valence la Trésorerie. On reading this it appears that the attack was somewhat inaccurate.
And from my account of Operation Dragoon (which is desperately in need of an update):

"[On 15 August 1944] Damage to Valence aerodrome further inhibited the bomber force and Fl.Div. 2 was informed that three KG 26 illuminators had landed as far afield as Strasbourg-Enzheim and Freiburg owing to the unserviceability of airfields to which they had been transferred pending repairs to Valence …

[On the 17th] Photographs taken by the Allies of Valence-La Trésorerie suggested that "several Ju 88s" had been destroyed by bombing."

There's a lot of other references too.
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Old 29th December 2009, 01:02
Larry deZeng Larry deZeng is offline
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Re: Valence airfield

Miscellaneous Postscript:

In June 1944, the main body of le.Flak-Abt. 741 (mot) was at Montpellier under Flak-Rgt. 85 (5. Flakbrigade), so the elements at Valence were probably no more than a single battery, and probably not even that. The Abteilung only had a total of 3 batteries. The Kommandeur was Obstlt. Hans Wulff in June 1944.

Another unit there was Flak-Mast 2/WF.

I have an 11p. Air Ministry periodic report from June 1944 entitled, Targets: Training, Headquarters, Parks, and Depots in the West, classified Top Secret that identifies about 250 locations with one or more of these installations in France, Belgium, Holland and Germany. Valence is not listed. That doesn’t mean there was nothing there, but rather that there wasn’t much there.

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