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  #1  
Old 27th April 2009, 14:10
Hans Nauta Hans Nauta is offline
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Hans Nauta
1./BFlSt196 13th June 1941 and KTB Seekriegsleitung

Dear all,

I hope someone is able to point me in the right direction for obtaining information from primary documents.

I'm looking for details of air operations of the Ar 196's of 1./BFlSt196 on 13th June 1941. On this date a German pilot was picked up from the North Sea by this unit.

I doubt wether a KTB has survived of this unit, but perhaps KTB's of higher level structures may contain info. I've some pages of the KTB Seekriegsleitung which surprisingly also contain detailed actions about the Küstenfliegergruppen and Bordfliegerstaffeln.

This KTB has been published in 68 volumes, but I've never seen the content of this publication and doubt whether the pages with air operations are also included.

Attached an example of one of the pages. Can anyone confirm whether this is indeed a page of the KTB SKL?

Or has somebody other info on file regarding air operations of teh 1./BFlSt196 on 13th June 1941?

Thanks in advance for your effort,
Hans Nauta

Last edited by Hans Nauta; 27th April 2009 at 14:17. Reason: Forgot attachment
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  #2  
Old 27th April 2009, 15:03
Larry deZeng Larry deZeng is offline
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Re: 1./BFlSt196 13th June 1941 and KTB Seekriegsleitung

Hans -

I have looked through 10 or 12 randomly selected volumes of the 68-volume set and detailed daily entries from Gen.d.Lw.beim OKM, Führer der Luft, etc., are not included. However, there are very brief summaries of significant events and actions concerning air assets when they had a direct impact on the Kriegsmarine. The summaries are the type that might be prepared for flag-level commanders who were not interested in and did not need to know the minor details of day-to-day operations.

Larry
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  #3  
Old 27th April 2009, 15:40
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Andreas Brekken Andreas Brekken is offline
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Re: 1./BFlSt196 13th June 1941 and KTB Seekriegsleitung

Hi.

During my last two visits to BAMA I noticed that a large number of KTB's from Bordfliegergruppe 196 have been added to the Findbuch for flying units.

I believe I ordered some copies from some of them (or one of my team members did)

Will check what we have, but the assumption (very natural) that KTB's of the Bordfliegergruppe have vanished is wrong, and they should be available for study at the BAMA in Freiburg.

Regards,
Andreas B
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Old 27th April 2009, 16:07
Hans Nauta Hans Nauta is offline
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Re: 1./BFlSt196 13th June 1941 and KTB Seekriegsleitung

Hello Larry and Andreas,

Larry, thanks for your effort in checking the KTB's of the SKL. It's clear that these apparently don't contain the info what I'm looking for. Thanks anyway!

Andreas, indeed very interesting to learn that some KTB's possibly survived. I've immediately checked the online Findbücher, but nothing pops up from that. Perhaps the KTB's aren't added to the online versions.

Do you perhaps have an archive reference for these KTB's? The 1./BFlSt196 was partially based at Amsterdam-Schellingwoude during 1940-1941 and I'm considering to order the complete KTB anyhow. May be of use for your team's research in Norway too.

Best regards,
Hans Nauta
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  #5  
Old 27th April 2009, 17:07
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ju55dk ju55dk is offline
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Re: 1./BFlSt196 13th June 1941 and KTB Seekriegsleitung

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hans Nauta View Post
Dear all,

I hope someone is able to point me in the right direction for obtaining information from primary documents.

I'm looking for details of air operations of the Ar 196's of 1./BFlSt196 on 13th June 1941. On this date a German pilot was picked up from the North Sea by this unit.

I doubt wether a KTB has survived of this unit, but perhaps KTB's of higher level structures may contain info. I've some pages of the KTB Seekriegsleitung which surprisingly also contain detailed actions about the Küstenfliegergruppen and Bordfliegerstaffeln.

This KTB has been published in 68 volumes, but I've never seen the content of this publication and doubt whether the pages with air operations are also included.

Attached an example of one of the pages. Can anyone confirm whether this is indeed a page of the KTB SKL?

Or has somebody other info on file regarding air operations of teh 1./BFlSt196 on 13th June 1941?

Thanks in advance for your effort,
Hans Nauta
The page is from KTB FlFüh. West.

Junker
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  #6  
Old 27th April 2009, 18:18
Hans Nauta Hans Nauta is offline
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Re: 1./BFlSt196 13th June 1941 and KTB Seekriegsleitung

Hello Junker,

Thanks for checking the origin of the page. This explains a lot now!

Regards,
Hans Nauta
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  #7  
Old 28th April 2009, 01:00
Kari Lumppio Kari Lumppio is offline
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Re: 1./BFlSt196 13th June 1941 and KTB Seekriegsleitung

Hello!

The BFGr 196 war diaries are in T1022 series. For this information I have to thank my friend Andrus. Check also this thread:
http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showthread.php?t=2209


Kari
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Old 28th April 2009, 08:31
Kari Lumppio Kari Lumppio is offline
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Re: 1./BFlSt196 13th June 1941 and KTB Seekriegsleitung

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hans Nauta View Post
I doubt wether a KTB has survived of this unit
Hello!

Me again. I now found the document from NARA which Andrus sent to me.

"KTB des Teilbordfliegerstaffels I/196 (shore-based units of Squadron 1, Group 196) - Aalborg, Jun-Jul 1941, Apr-Dec 1943: PG 80273-277, roll 3360
Boulogne, Aug 1940: PG 80278, roll 3360
Brest, Jan-Mar 1942: PG 80279, roll 3360
Drontheim (Trondheim), Apr-Jul 1942: PG 80280, roll 3360
Hammerfest, Sep-Oct 1941: PG 80281, roll 3360
List, Sylt, Apr-May 1940: PG 80282, roll 3360
Nest, Jun 1940: PG 80283, roll 3360
Pillau (Baltisk), Aug 1941, Nov 1942, Jun 1944: PG 80284-286, roll 3360
Reval (Tallinn), May-Oct 1942: PG 80287-288, roll 3360
Schellingwonde, Aug-Nov 1940, Mar-Aug 1941: PG 80289-291, roll 3360"



And like I wrote the file is T1022. Typo is on the original, emphasis mine.

All the best,
Kari
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  #9  
Old 28th April 2009, 10:58
Hans Nauta Hans Nauta is offline
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Re: 1./BFlSt196 13th June 1941 and KTB Seekriegsleitung

Hello Kari,

BINGO!!!

This is perhaps more than I initially hoped for! I'm glad I've a viewer here at home, so I'll order the film from the NARA.

Many, many thanks for your effort and help. You've really made my day!

Best wishes,
Hans Nauta
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  #10  
Old 28th April 2009, 16:29
jim norton jim norton is offline
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Re: 1./BFlSt196 13th June 1941 and KTB Seekriegsleitung

hi,
are there other ktb in the nara? i am looking for material about kg26. nothing to be found in the bama, but maybe in the nara?! i had a look into the online ctalogue, but did not ebven manage to find the ktb of the bordfliegergruppe. can someone help me?
all the best
jim
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