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Allied and Soviet Air Forces Please use this forum to discuss the Air Forces of the Western Allies and the Soviet Union.

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  #1  
Old 7th September 2023, 20:29
BrianC BrianC is offline
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British war crimes involving Luftwaffe aircrew 31 August 1940

Hi guys

Endeavouring to clarify a couple of unsavory incidents that may have occurred on 31 August 1940, reference Richard Collier's 1966 "Eagle Day".

Page 199:

(a) At Tandridge in Surrey, blood-crazed troops did a tribal dance round a hayrick, parading a German's head on a pitchfork

(b) LDV volunteer Richard May, hastening towards Coulsdon Golf Course where a German had baled out, met two soldiers who'd got there first. One of them, carrying a pilot's gauntlet glove, announced tersely "We've fixed him." In the field, May found a tall man wearing the Iron Cross, his head smashed to a pulp."

Were these reports factual? Were there other such incidents?

Cheers
Brian
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Old 8th September 2023, 01:20
Tim O. Tim O. is offline
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Re: British war crimes involving Luftwaffe aircrew 31 August 1940

Hi Brian

I suspect anyone who has been studying WW2 for any length of time can quote examples of unpleasant acts by all nations and also acts of kindness or even ‘chivalry’ by all sides. Personally, I find it hard to judge any of this from an arm chair decades later - the only real lesson for me is that war is horrific and best avoided.
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Tim O.

Looking for any information or documents relating to:
Alfred Schmittka 5./KG 54; Josef Harmeling 4.(Schlacht)/LG 2; Wilhelm Gaul 1./106, 2./906 & III./KG 40; Karl Müller I./KG 2; Werner Breese 5.(F)/122
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Old 8th September 2023, 09:03
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Re: British war crimes involving Luftwaffe aircrew 31 August 1940

Well put Tim. Over the years I have heard such stories but whether they were true or just local legend is another matter. The only well documented incident was Hptm Heinz Cramer of II./LG 1 but that was not a war crime per se rather maltreatment which resulted in court martial
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Old 8th September 2023, 12:55
BrianC BrianC is offline
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Re: British war crimes involving Luftwaffe aircrew 31 August 1940

Hi guys

Tim: I agree entirely with your sentiments, but such crimes apparently did occur and I am only trying to establish the facts.

Chris: I'm not aware of the Cramer 'incident', only that he was shot down and captured on 17 September 1940. Can't find anything on Google; perhaps you'll kindly advise a reference.

Cheers
Brian
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Old 8th September 2023, 13:53
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Re: British war crimes involving Luftwaffe aircrew 31 August 1940

Google Lt Col Guy Drake-Brockman. I believe Coulsdon Golf Course was 3./ZG 26 6 Sep 40 (Cannons Hill Golf Course) and the pilot, Uffz Christoph Klein, was the only casualty and was killed when the aircraft hit the ground. BF baled out wounded and was captured-nothing to support troops doing anything untoward to BF.
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Old 9th September 2023, 05:40
Alex Smart Alex Smart is offline
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Re: British war crimes involving Luftwaffe aircrew 31 August 1940

Luftwaffe Pilot Chrisoph KlEHN, was killed on the 6th September 1940.
Rest at Cannock Chase German Military Cemetery, Staffordshire, UK.
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Old 9th September 2023, 12:45
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Re: British war crimes involving Luftwaffe aircrew 31 August 1940

Agree Kiehn-auto-correct and fat fingers. No evidence at all of what was written in the book
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Old 19th September 2023, 18:50
BrianC BrianC is offline
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Re: British war crimes involving Luftwaffe aircrew 31 August 1940

Hi guys

To continue ....

Had the unfortunate Chrisoph Kiehn been awarded the Iron Cross?

Is there a report of recovery of his body?

May this have been the man mentioned in Richard Collier's report?

Comments/thoughts appreciated.

Cheers
Brian
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Old 19th September 2023, 19:10
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Re: British war crimes involving Luftwaffe aircrew 31 August 1940

Pilot was killed in the aircraft and no mention of anything apart from EKM and Wehrpass
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Old 19th September 2023, 20:56
BrianC BrianC is offline
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Re: British war crimes involving Luftwaffe aircrew 31 August 1940

Thanks, Chris

I'm not doubting your word, but how can you be so definite? Have you access to official documentation?

Cheers
Brian
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