21 Nov. 1943 eastern front

[Dennis Peschier]

I found these beautiful drawing of an aerial engagement on a Russian language site. The only thing I can read is 21st November 1943. Can it be linked to a known incident?

https://vk.com/albums-140181428?fbcl...otos-140181428

[Courtois Laurent]

Hello,

It is written :


"Схема воздушногобо 8 Лагг-3 88 Ноороссиского ИАП против 16 Ю-87 и 4 Ме-109. 21.11.1943г"

Scheme of aerial fight between 8 Lagg-3 88th Novorossi aIAP versus 16 Ju-87 and 4 Me-109. 11/21/1943

Its the 88th IAP of the 229 IAD, 4th VA (Aerial Army). the aera is the Kertch Strait.


I will look in the Tsamo.

Laurent Alexandre

[sidney]

15.(kroat.)/JG 52 lost one aircraft that day, Zdenko Avdić (10 claims in 18 engagements) was the pilot. This was the incident when he lost his arm.


21/11/1943; 15.(kroat.)/JG 52; Pl.Qu. 66592; Notlandung; Bf 109 G-6; W.Nr. 18497; 20%; Uffz. Avdiz, Zwenko; verw.

[Laurent Rizzotti]

Avions HS n° 49 on 15./JG 52 says the following about the morning of 21 November 1943:

_ at least two pilots of 15./JG 52, Oblt Mato Dukovac and Uffz Zdenko Advic, were flying escort for Stuka and met Soviet fighters. Dukovac claimed a Lagg-3 at 0915 hrs, Advic another at 0917 hrs ,and Dukovac claimed a P-39 at 0920 hrs. As said above, Advic was then attacked from behind by four more "Lagg", was wounded and crash-landed in German lines.
_ pilots of II./JG 52 were also active in the area at the same time and claimed four victories without loss: Oblt Wilhelm Batz a Jak-1 at 0915 hrs, Hptm Gerhard Barkhorn a Jak-1 at 0922 hrs, Oblt Wilhelm Batz a Jak-1 at 0940 hrs and Fw Heinz Sachsenberg a Jak-1 at 0948 hrs.

The above book said the following about the Soviet side:
_ 42 IAP claimed 3 Bf 109 shot down (by St Lt Fedor Kalugin, Ml Lt Nikolay Rayenko and St Meit Ahmey-Khan Kankoshev (who also claimed a Bf 109 damaged)) for the loss of a Yak-1 (Ml Lt Konstantion Morozik heavily wounded).
_ 88 IAP claimed 1 Bf 109 shot down by Lt Nikolay Shakhin and lost one Lagg-3 (Lt Nikolay Sharonov baled out).
_ 66 IAP claimed 2 Bf 109s shot down (by St Lt Pavel Kamozin and Ml Lt Fedor Rusakov) and lost one P-39 (Ml Lt Fedor Rusakov baled out).
_ 57 GIAP claimed 1 Bf 109 shot down by Ml Lt Ivan Sayanniy but Ml Lt Pavel Kulagin was killed (aircraft type not given).

Seven Soviet claims for one German loss (actually only damaged), and on the other side seven German and Kroat claims for 4 Soviet losses. I guess that there were more than four Bf 109s in the area (five pilots made claims). It is also possible that there were several actions (especially one at 0915-0922 hrs and one at 0940-0948, with a quarter of a hour between them). Still the fact that no Soviet pilots made a claim against the Ju 87 probably means that German fighters were able to repulse them.

By the way, the Rumanian Grupul 3 flew two sorties that day, both with nine Ju 87 and reported that weather was so bad that no fighter can come to escort them.... No time is given but I guess they did not fly in the above battle. The first mission was intercepted by Soviet Jaks that badly damaged the leader Ju 87 that was written-off in a forced-landing near Bagorowo, crew safe. The gunner claimed a Yak damaged. Another gunner claimed another Yak damaged, but that crew too had to force-land near Bagorowo, but the aircraft was repaired.
Edited: source of the latter: "Romanian Black Hussars", by Jean-Louis Roba and Cristian Craciunoiu

[sidney]

The wounded pilot was Uffz. Zdenko Avdić (i.e., not Advic), the author of the Avions article misspelled his name - not terribly so, but still...

And yes, apparently no Ju 87 Stuka losses that day.