Luftwaffe and Allied Air Forces Discussion Forum  

Go Back   Luftwaffe and Allied Air Forces Discussion Forum > Discussion > Allied and Soviet Air Forces

Allied and Soviet Air Forces Please use this forum to discuss the Air Forces of the Western Allies and the Soviet Union.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 22nd June 2006, 18:00
Michal Michal is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 479
Michal
USAF vs VVS Incidents March 1945

Hello,

does somebody know more? Does somebody know to which unit US planes (or in second case VVS planes as well) belonged?

1) Major Anatoliy Leonidovich Kozhevnikov (CO of 212th GIAP, 22nd GIAD, 2nd VA, Ace with 27 kills) attacked one B-17G nearby frontline, some 8 kilometers out of Brieg A/F. Kozhevnikov damaged ship and she was able to land at Brieg A/F. According to soviet sources ship had s/n 44-6642 and flew back from bombing of Berlin (in fact it could be Ruhland as well). Commander of plane was Capt. Forst. After several days and repair, B-17G took off. Plane probably belonged to some of group of 5th BW.

2) German planes should attacked US fighters and bombers over Morin, some 35 kilometers NW Küstrin, when 6 Yak-3s appeared and attacked German planes. According to Soviet document, Mustangs attacked Yaks and all in all 6 Yaks were shot down, 2 KIA and 1 WIA.

Thanks for help

Michal
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 23rd June 2006, 12:08
Jack Sanders Jack Sanders is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: The Hague
Posts: 29
Jack Sanders is on a distinguished road
Re: USAF vs VVS Incidents March 1945

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michal
Hello,

does somebody know more?

2) German planes should attacked US fighters and bombers over Morin, some 35 kilometers NW Küstrin, when 6 Yak-3s appeared and attacked German planes. According to Soviet document, Mustangs attacked Yaks and all in all 6 Yaks were shot down, 2 KIA and 1 WIA.

Thanks for help

Michal
Hello!

I know a little about the second event because it is described in the Osprey title covering the 359th FG. 4 flights of the 369th FS of the 359th FG were involved, and the combat started at an altitude of 10000 ft "over an airfield at Zackerick, north of Kustrin". La-5 fighters were also encountered, yet there is no mention of Soviet unit designations.

Yours,

Jack Sanders
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 23rd June 2006, 18:04
Michal Michal is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 479
Michal
Re: USAF vs VVS Incidents March 1945

Thx. Is there written how many Soviet planes US Airmen shot down?
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 24th June 2006, 05:23
Evgeny Velichko's Avatar
Evgeny Velichko Evgeny Velichko is offline
Alter Hase
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Stalingrad
Posts: 1,289
Evgeny Velichko is on a distinguished road
Re: USAF vs VVS Incidents March 1945

Hi all!

I know (but actually dont remember the date) that I.Kozhedub (Best allyed ace, 62 kills) has in reality 64 kills, & tha last 2 kills are P-51 (I saw guncam of that claims.

He defended a B-17 from attack of Fw 190, then appeared 2 Mustangs & attacked him. The only choise to defend himself was to shot down both.

Pilot of first was killed, but second survived, & when russian stabofficier asced "Who shot You?", He answered " A Fw 190 with red nose". BTW: survived american pilot was afro-american.

Also, I know about few moments, when P-38 were strafing some Soviet transport columns in April - May 1945, & some of thwm were shot down.

S!
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 24th June 2006, 13:07
Franek Grabowski Franek Grabowski is offline
Alter Hase
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Warsaw, Poland
Posts: 2,382
Franek Grabowski is on a distinguished road
Re: USAF vs VVS Incidents March 1945

I understand Kozhedub was credited with 63 kills but his combat with USAAF seems mythical to say the least.
Gun camera film seems to be a captured German stuff, presence of Negro American pilots seems doubtful to say the least and there are no US losses that would fit reputed claim.
Well, even an exact date of supposed incident was not established without any doubt.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 24th June 2006, 13:57
Michal Michal is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 479
Michal
Re: USAF vs VVS Incidents March 1945

Kozhedub wrote in his memories that somewhere at the end of March or first half of april 1945 defended with Dmitriy Nechayev one B-17 from attack of 2 Me-109 and 8 Fw 190s. Kozhedub claimed 2 Fw 190s. Is this the case about you wrote?

I don´t know Kozhedub should shot down P-51s.

Another soviet ace, who damaged B-17, was Konstantin Vasilyevich Suchov (21 kills, 16. giap, 9. giad, 2. VA). Sometimes in first half of april he attacked B-17 about whom he supposed it was Ju-52 flying to Breslau. Flying Fortress was force-landed at Czenstochowa A/F.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 24th June 2006, 14:54
Sabredog Sabredog is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Denver, Colo
Posts: 16
Sabredog is on a distinguished road
Re: USAF vs VVS Incidents March 1945

m,
B-17 # 44-6642 was assigned to 2BG, 49th BS Amendola.

Regards,
Hugh
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 24th June 2006, 19:59
Ivo de Jong Ivo de Jong is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 72
Ivo de Jong
Re: USAF vs VVS Incidents March 1945

Another interesting incident was on March 18. B-17G 44-8276 of the 487th BG was hit by flak over Berlin and left the formation, heading in easterly direction. It was then attacked by Russian Yaks, which hit the aircraft while the crew was in the process of bailing out. Crewmembers were actually strafed in their chutes, and two of them were killed. They were buried by the Russians, and their graves were never retraced after the war.
The incident happened on the same day that P-51s of the 359th FG had shot down nine Russian a/c, mostly YAK's, in an encounter near Kustrin. They mistook the YAK's for FW-190s.... This incident is covered in depth in the 359th FG History "Mustangs and Unicorns".
Best regards,
Ivo de Jong
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 25th June 2006, 05:27
Kutscha Kutscha is offline
Alter Hase
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,102
Kutscha
Re: USAF vs VVS Incidents March 1945

Ivo the La-5/-7 had a radial engine and would look more like the Fw190. Jaks were inline V-12 engines and might be mistaken for Me109s.

I know your are taking what you said from the unit's history.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Documentation of 2000HP Bf 109s of 1945 Kurfürst Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces 5 10th September 2009 12:15
I./JG 52 on March 11 1945? Michal Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces 5 9th June 2006 20:30
Losses of B-17's in RCM role paul peters Allied and Soviet Air Forces 4 15th February 2006 20:57
SG 4 March 25 1945 Michal Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces 4 25th October 2005 16:24
Lost Soviet Bostons on March 23, 1945 HGabor Allied and Soviet Air Forces 0 14th June 2005 18:15


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 09:25.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004 - 2018, 12oclockhigh.net