Luftwaffe and Allied Air Forces Discussion Forum  

Go Back   Luftwaffe and Allied Air Forces Discussion Forum > Discussion > Allied and Soviet Air Forces

Allied and Soviet Air Forces Please use this forum to discuss the Air Forces of the Western Allies and the Soviet Union.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 18th December 2008, 16:23
Pathfinder Pathfinder is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 197
Pathfinder is on a distinguished road
Lancaster varients

I'm embarking on a Lancaster artwork. Strange as it may seem, in all my years as an aviation artist I've never actually done this aircraft!

Anyway, I'm depicting a Lancaster Mk III.

My first question:

1) Is the MkIII the same as the BIII?

2) I believe the MKIII is externally identical to the MkI?

3) As these MkIIIs had Packard Merlin's, where as the MKIs had Rolls-Royce Merlins, were the engine housings/nacelles any different? Profiles seem to suggest they are externally the same.

Thanks in advance
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 18th December 2008, 18:09
Kutscha Kutscha is offline
Alter Hase
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,102
Kutscha
Re: Lancaster varients

1) Lancaster B. MkIII

2) yes

3) R-R and Packard engines were interchangeable. Some a/c could have a mix of engines.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 18th December 2008, 18:36
Franek Grabowski Franek Grabowski is offline
Alter Hase
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Warsaw, Poland
Posts: 2,352
Franek Grabowski is on a distinguished road
Re: Lancaster varients

Correct designation is Lancaster III or Lancaster B.III, the prefix depending on variant.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 18th December 2008, 21:57
Graham Boak Graham Boak is offline
Alter Hase
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Lancashire, UK
Posts: 1,680
Graham Boak is on a distinguished road
Re: Lancaster varients

Lancaster III is not a correct official designation. The correct designation was the B Mk.III, as the role prefixes had come into use by this time. Later variants included the GR Mk.III (I believe). If you wished to group them together then they were all Lancaster Mk.IIIs. It may be that in some references the "Mk." may have been understood rather than explicitly stated, but it was there in the official designation.

It is correct to say that a Mk.I and a Mk.III Lancaster would be externally identical, if they were produced at the same time. Details of the aircraft did vary with time, and some of the early features will only have been seen on Mk.Is. Features to look out for include the bombaimer's blister and the number of windows down the side - if any. No doubt Lancaster enthusiasts could point out more.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 19th December 2008, 01:34
Franek Grabowski Franek Grabowski is offline
Alter Hase
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Warsaw, Poland
Posts: 2,352
Franek Grabowski is on a distinguished road
Re: Lancaster varients

Graham, I meant overuse of the word Mark. It was intended to be used interchangeably with type's name, eg. Lancaster III or various Lancasters, MkIs & MkIIIs. Of course, life rules prevailed, but if there are people ready to die for Bf prefix, I think we can afford some little nit picking.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 19th December 2008, 11:29
Graham Boak Graham Boak is offline
Alter Hase
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Lancashire, UK
Posts: 1,680
Graham Boak is on a distinguished road
Re: Lancaster varients

That's why I stressed the official side of things. Informally, people called them what they liked. Thankfully, they didn't have to consider that a Corsair II wasn't the same thing as a Corsair Mk.II.

I do believe that possible confusions can be reduced if we use the official terminology when it does add clarity. Differentiating between different variants is one area where this is true. There's a thread on j-aircraft lamenting the use of the Allied code names for WW2 Japanese aircraft, now that the official Japanese names are known, but here I think the the opposite is true: the "incorrect" use is preferable for clarity.

There are similar points raised about the use of the A/B/C system for RAF roundels. It is totally unofficial but so much clearer. More unclear is the present state of the NATO names for Soviet types: I'm sure almost everyone speaks of MiG 15s not Fagots, yet is quite happy with Bears and Badgers. Not to mention Fitters and Floggers (though the initial confusion around the MiG 23 designation must have helped there). It will be interesting to see if use of the NATO codenames disappears quicker that the Allied codenames for Japanese types!

Apologies if this is moving too far from the original question.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 19th December 2008, 15:44
VoyTech VoyTech is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 198
VoyTech is on a distinguished road
Re: Lancaster varients

Are you sure, Graham? It seems, "Lancaster II" was an official designation, so I presume "Lancaster I" or "Lancaster III" may have been, too.
They don't seem to have Lancaster Pilot's Notes' previews on amazon, but those for Wellington and Spitfire show that the "Mk." was used much like Franek said:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/0859...pt#reader-link
http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/0859...pt#reader-link
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 19th December 2008, 17:26
Pathfinder Pathfinder is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 197
Pathfinder is on a distinguished road
Re: Lancaster varients

Excellent, thanks for the info guys. My concern for this project is primarily the external differences, so I think I'm covered for now. Very intersting comments though.

Thanks again.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 19th December 2008, 18:55
Bill Walker's Avatar
Bill Walker Bill Walker is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 324
Bill Walker is on a distinguished road
Re: Lancaster varients

Role prefix letters (like B for Bomber) were introduced in the UK in 1942, and applied retroactively to all aircraft then in service. It appears that it took several years for the use of them to become common. Depending on the date, an individual aircraft could correctly be called a Lancaster Mk. III, or a Lancaster B. Mk. III. Both would commonly, but unofficially, be referred to as a Lancaster III.
__________________
Bill Walker
Canadian Military Aircraft Serials
www.rwrwalker.ca/index.htm
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 19th December 2008, 21:27
Nick Beale's Avatar
Nick Beale Nick Beale is offline
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Exeter, England
Posts: 5,795
Nick Beale has a spectacular aura aboutNick Beale has a spectacular aura aboutNick Beale has a spectacular aura about
Re: Lancaster varients

If you can find a copy of Martin Streetly's "The Aircraft of 100 Group", IIRC it's very good on descriptions and diagrams of the differences between marks of RAF bomber types. I think it was based on a series of articles for a modelling magazine.
__________________
Nick Beale
http://www.ghostbombers.com
Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Lancaster loss ND672 22/23 March 1944 FrankieS Allied and Soviet Air Forces 11 30th December 2009 17:58
97 Squadron at Bourn (Black Thursday) Julian Allied and Soviet Air Forces 2 2nd June 2008 00:02
Please Help - Lancaster EE138 peterf Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces 9 14th February 2007 00:32
28 May 1944 Bourg Leopold attack lancaster Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces 3 6th February 2007 08:00
RAF 156 Sqdn Lancaster Crash Site Wayne Welford Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces 2 2nd June 2006 18:12


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 09:50.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004 - 2018, 12oclockhigh.net