Event dated 19.9.1944 3 x YAK-9 shot down Belgrade

[researcher111]

An other puzzle I am after is as into the fate of 3 x YAK's
of 168 GvIAP which departed on September 19,1944
from Bucharest airfield Pipera or Leordeni airfields enroute
to their new airfield at Dechempeni presumed as Oradea .

Rather arrive on their ETA's and land all 3 pilots may
have got engaged air to air over Belgrade shot down
or mistakenly landing there due to Nav error .

All 3 pilots managed to be captured unharmed, then
arrive at Stalag Luft II for Soviet airmen Litzmannstadt (Lodj)
The Soviet leader was an expert ranked major with 6
confirmed kills , pilot with VVS since 1939. At a later point
in time all 3 attempted an escape were captured by SD
in Poland, then executed by Gestapo near Frankfurt and
like in many similar cases cremated . Their remains were
never found .

1) Which Luftwaffe unit and pilots claimed over Belgrade
YAK-1, 3 or 9's or Soviet fighters in the early or late afternoon
or which Luftwaffe airfield reported the landing ?

2) Which Luftwaffe unit reported a loss over Belgrade
and what type of aircraft ?

Cheers
Alex K

[newcomer]

I show your message to one of my friend who explore russian sites like Pamyat naroda, etc. He said that in the unit diary he didn't find anything. Maybe it will help if you quoted the names of that pilots?

kind regards

Newcomer

[researcher111]

I have no idea who u are, therefore unable
to verify if this what you say is genuine
which in fact I think is not .

I have all info available , send me a Pvt
with your email and we will take it from
there . By the way is your Russian name
"Newcomer" or do you go by an other name ?

PS : If your friends are from Pam.Naroda
and really got the 168th GvIAP Opersvodka,
is all in there , if they claim otherwise then
your request is not genuine !

Alex K

[kirche]

Originally Posted by newcomer

Maybe it will help if you quoted the names of that pilots?

Hello,
Vlasov Nikolay Alekseevich
https://pamyat-naroda.ru/heroes/memo..._plen272051666

Semenov Viktor Nikolaevich
https://pamyat-naroda.ru/heroes/memo..._plen272193013

Schchankin (Shankin, Shapkin) Vasily Rufeevich
https://pamyat-naroda.ru/heroes/kld-..._officer203355
https://pamyat-naroda.ru/heroes/memo...esenie84462061
https://pamyat-naroda.ru/heroes/kld-..._officer416081

According to documents 10 Gw.ShAD - flight 168 Gw.IAP 19.09.1944 from the airfield of the "Banyasa" (near Bucharest) to the airfield "Balomyirul-De-Kempeni"

Non-combat losses of 10 gw.Shad for September 1944: "Total non-combat losses of 5 fighters - 4 Yak-1b and 1 Yak-9.
Сircumstances: during the flight of four Yak-1b crews from the Bucharest airfield to the new location (Balomyirul-De-Kempeni airfield), they did not land at their own airfield, the location and condition of the crews is not known..." (From TsAMO RF, fund 327, inventory 4999, case 187)

[newcomer]

Thank you Kirche for your kind reply.

regards

Newcomer

[HGabor]

168 GvIAP also had another 'loss' on Sept 19, 1944 in Bucharest. 17 VA, 236 IAD, 168 GvIAP pilot Ml.Lt. Aleksandr Fedorovich Grachev was shot dead by Soviet military police (MP) patrol along with his friend Sorokin after a drinking party, while things got out of hands and the patrol tried to intervene.

Gabor

[researcher111]

Gabor / Yes 100% the pilot was shot by a Russian MP Patrol after a drunk party but not thread
related , perhaps more relevant for my thread is if you know when 168 GvIAP became
part of 5th VA and when it moved to 17th VA ?

Kirche / Is not called Banyasa but then was called Pipera ( Baneasa) the
departure airfield is still not clear same as the grounds on why they arrived
over Belgrade and on how the three again managed to escape from Stalag Luft II Lodj
though all this I've already mentioned in the begining of the thread .

For general information case was on hands on NKVD due to suspicion of treason / escape though
not proven and many other facts which are not available on OBD but only through Russian Fed
archives

PS : YAK-1 Vlasov's plane ? I doubt

[HGabor]

Well, the 611 IAP (with 32 Yak-1Bs and 10 Yak-9Ts, Ms) was transferred to the 288 IAD by September 19, 1944 in Burgas, Bulgaria from the 236 IAD. So perhaps that's the date when the 168 GvIAP was moved too. At least this day they lost 3 Yak-1Bs at Belgrad.

Gabor

[kirche]

Originally Posted by researcher111

Kirche / Is not called Banyasa but then was called Pipera ( Baneasa)
...
PS : YAK-1 Vlasov's plane ? I doubt

I do not know what the correct name of this airfield is, but I see how airfields of 168 Gw.IAP in September 1944 were named Chief of Staff of 10 Gw.ShAD Guards Colonel Artemyev and Head of the operational department Guard Major Usanov.
168 Gw.IAP was based in September at the airfield "ТЕКУЧИ" (6 days), at the airfield "БАНЯСА" (or "БЕНЯСА") (15 days) and at the "БАЛОМЫРУЛ-ДЕ-КЕМПЕНИ" airfield (9 days).
"ПИПЕРА" airfield is listed as a base for aircrafts of other two regiments of the same division.
The composition of the regiment is listed as - "Yak fighters" (without modification which rather indicates a mixed composition).

168 Gw.IAP documents of this time are not publicly available on the official TsAMO websites, and the division documents are only those copies that were sent to the headquarters of the 5th VA. Probably documents of the required level have not yet been scanned (or have already been scanned, but not published).
In any case, only operational documents and summary reports from TsAMO are published. Documents on personnel (in addition to what is available on MO RF sites) and movement of planes/engines should be viewed in the archive.

[researcher111]

Yes is correct in Sept 44 they were at Tecuci , then Pipera ( Baneasa Bucharest ) and then Decampeni
probably somewhere near Oradea. Also correct the mixed fleet of YAK-1 , 3 and 9 . The 5th VA
documents may not be as good as the 168th Opersvodka , because by Sept they may have been
under 17th VA . Relevant remaining the grounds on why they arrived over Belgrade and how the three
again managed to stage an escape from Lodj on 27.10.44,aslo why the remaining two of them were
handed over by SD Lodj to Gestapo Frankfurt just in order to be executed later on.

An other open thing is not clear when exactly the GvIAP 168 became part of 17VA