1Lt. John L, RYDER, O-701808.

[Alex Smart]

Seeking details of the loss of 1Lt.John L, RYDER, O-701808, 31st Fighter Group, 307th Fighter Squadron.
Killed on 29th December 1944.
Aircraft type was a P-51 Mustang.
There does not seem to be an MACR for his loss ?

112 Sqdn Tribute Website gives the following -
"In Bad Weather , Lt. Ryder's P - 51 went into a Spin and Crashed at Larino , Italy. Possibly from Vertigo. No other Info".

What happened and what was the aircraft serial number ?
Alex

[RSwank]

Newspaper story on the loss:

https://www.newspapers.com/article/t...tar/142057417/


His brother was also MIA/KIA at about the same time:

https://pacificwrecks.com/aircraft/b-24/44-49480.html

[Russell]

Alex

He was flying in formation as part of Mission No 742, when he disappeared at 1430. He was later found crashed and killed, the reason was not known at the time of the Mission report being written. Presumably spun out of control and crashed after vertigo or equipment failure in the clouds.

Source Mission Report in BO110A of 30 Jan 73 from Maxwell. Part of the Group History Files.

Russell

[Alex Smart]

Thank you Rolland and Russell for your replies, appreciated.
Just wondering why there wasn't an MACR made for his loss, was the area they were flying over when he went down in Allied control ?
Thanks again,
Alex

[RSwank]

Alex, the Italian front lines were just south of Bologna at the end of 1944. Larino is about 40 miles NE of Foggia. The crash site was well behind allied lines. Since Ryder's crash site and his status was known from the time of the crash, he was never really "missing", so no MACR.

[Alex Smart]

Thanks for the confirmation Rolland, any chance there could be an accident report ? I do have one for a Female P-51 Pilot that went down off of San Francisco.

[RSwank]

He does not come up in the Accident Data Base found on the Aviation Archaeology website, (see first database on the page).

https://aviationarchaeology.com/dbSelectAirForce.asp

[Russell]

Hi all

This is the problem with USAAF records. He was on a combat mission, thus not an accident and no accident report, unless the group volunteered to do one. As was pointed out, behind Allied lines, thus not a MACR if he was found quickly enough, i.e. within a day or so, otherwise there would be a MACR. These things are a black art, as I have a B-17 crash landing in Italy with one dead and two WiA, but no MACR. Yet if one of the crew baled out over enemy lines there was a MACR. Leaving me to wonder how they dealt with the KiA/WiA on bombers that got back to base. Is there a separate report?

Russell