RAF coordinates in WW II

[Günther Ott]

The RAF position coordinate V 7595 was applied by a nighfighter in January 1944. Can anyone provide for a decoding into usual geographical coordinates?
Thanks
Günther

[Jaap Woortman]

Günther,

See http://www.echodelta.net/mbs/eng-welcome.php

Jaap

[Günther Ott]

Thanks, Jaap, but the given coordinates "V 7595" do not match with the well known "Modified British System" and I thought that RAF night fighters might have applied a different grid system. This was also the case with Luftwaffe night fighters, possibly for similar reasons.

Günther

[mhuxt]

It helps to know the rough area first, as there are a number of V such-and-suches. Was this mid-channel, north of Switzerland, or near Berlin, for example? You need the correct map, then a wV, or an sV etc.

[Jaap Woortman]

Originally Posted by mhuxt

It helps to know the rough area first, as there are a number of V such-and-suches. Was this mid-channel, north of Switzerland, or near Berlin, for example? You need the correct map, then a wV, or an sV etc.

Günther,

Mhuxt is 100% right. See in the same site http://www.echodelta.net/mbs/eng-overview.php for an explanation and map. For North-west Europe see the map in the appendix.
You will see that there are voor V7595 several possibilities.
If you are more specific we may be can give some help. Date, Squadron, what has happened there.
One of the possibilities is the border area between Groningen, Drenthe and Nieder-Saksen. A place where I have spent 24 years of my life. I has my special interest.

Jaap

[Günther Ott]

Thanks for your efforts, mhuxt and Jaap. The problem is exactly that there are several possibilities for V 7595 since the second letter is apparently missing. The rough area was likely mid-channel, so that wV7595 would be the best choice. However, vX and vZ in British Cassini Grid cannot be excluded, same as vL and vG in the Nord de Guerre zone. They are all combined with the letter v and all would have covered also some portions of mid-channel areas.

Günther

[mhuxt]

Hi Again,

In my experience (mostly nightfighters, interestingly enough, which is why I'm intrigued with this thread), it's generally the *first* letter that's missing from the position reference. I've got a number of combat reports in which this is the case: pilot has given map reference as, for example, V1234, and I've then had to go off to echodelta and work it out. "Let's see, 2nd TAF nightfighter, front lines about here at the time, sortie over the Netherlands, let's try xV1234 ... ok, that's about right."

If the nightfighter involved in the case you're after was a Mosquito, I may well be able to provide more information, hint hint. For Beaufighters, not directly, however they are almost certain to have been using the British Cassini grid for defensive patrols.

So, as I say, I don't think you should interpret your info as having the second of the two letters missing. I would think V *is* the second letter - what you've got to do is identify the general area, then find the correct map (Nord de Guerre, etc) then look for a grid square in which the second letter is V, note the first letter, then go to echodelta's wonderful coordinates translator and enter in the full reference. For example the mid-channel reference would be wV7595 on the British Cassini Grid.

[Günther Ott]

I also see that wV7595 would be the best choice for the coordinates "7595" as given in the personal combat report of F/O Nowell and F/SGT Randall of No. 85 Squadron. The Mosquito XII VY-N had successfully attacked a German bomber early in the morning of 22 January 1944, initially identified as a Ju 88 but subsequently quoted as a He 177.

However, wV7595 on the British Cassini Grid would hardly match with a position at sea six miles south-east of Hastings as mentioned in literature and a surviving crew member claimed a hit by AA fire. So there would be some reason for assuming that a different He 177 had been met by Mosquito XII VY-N. I also wonder if its RAF serial is known.