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Allied and Soviet Air Forces Please use this forum to discuss the Air Forces of the Western Allies and the Soviet Union.

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  #541  
Old 24th March 2010, 15:05
Laurent Rizzotti Laurent Rizzotti is offline
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Re: Friendly fire WWII

Some days are like that... every foray in Google today brings me another "friendly fire" case. I swear I'm not searching these !

26 October 1942: Ju 87 D-1 WNr 2629 of III./StG 1 shot down by German artillery shell near Strelitsy, USSR. Both crew (Hptm Heinz Fischer (pilot and Staka 7./StG 1) and Uffz Fritz Zethmeier (radio)) were killed

More details (in French):
http://www.luftfahrtverlag-start.de/...anzoesisch.pdf
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  #542  
Old 24th March 2010, 22:04
Observer1940 Observer1940 is offline
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Re: Friendly fire WWII

Hello All

Were you aware that the ratio of aircraft and crews lost to balloons in early WW2, British to German was 4:1?

Four British aircraft, for every (One) German aircraft and even some of those German aircraft were shared with AA.

In March 1941, Arthur T. Harris was absolutely livid and furious with the Chief of the Air Staff when he realised how many crews and aircraft had already been lost since the beginning of the war.

Mark
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  #543  
Old 30th March 2010, 21:04
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Jan.Safarik Jan.Safarik is offline
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Re: Friendly fire WWII

Hello Brian

Georgii Dmitriyevich Kostylev (Костылев Георгий Дмитриевич) and Igor Aleksandrovich Kaberov (Каберов Игорь Александрович) from 2nd eskadrilya 3st GIAP KBF on Hurricane aircraft destroyed one I-153 of Petr Ignatyevich Biskup (Бискуп Пётр Игнатьевич) from 4. GIAP KBF over Nizino airfield in July 1942.

Sources:
Абрамов, Александр: Красные соколы, Лучшие Асы России, 1914 - 1953 гг., http://airaces.narod.ru/.
Šedivý, Miloš - Dymič, Valerij: Triumf a tragédie, Sovětští stíhací letci v bojích II. světové války, Svět křídel 2001.

JAN
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  #544  
Old 31st March 2010, 01:55
NUPPOL NUPPOL is offline
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Re: Friendly fire WWII

What was name of POW died-burial unknown?
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  #545  
Old 8th April 2010, 11:54
Brian Brian is offline
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Re: Friendly fire WWII

Thanks for all the latest gen.

Volume I of Blue-on-Blue (1939/1940) is currently being 'processed' so hopefully something will appear before long!!

Cheers
Brian
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  #546  
Old 16th April 2010, 18:14
Laurent Rizzotti Laurent Rizzotti is offline
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Re: Friendly fire WWII

Another case?

29 December 1944: Four Typhoons attacked power station at Nijmegen, four rounds were fired by 365 Bty, 115 HAA Rgt. Typhoons dived to 800 ft and were escorted away by Spitfires.

Source:
http://www.royalartilleryunitsnether...D_6269690.html
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  #547  
Old 28th April 2010, 17:11
Laurent Rizzotti Laurent Rizzotti is offline
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Re: Friendly fire WWII

German friendly case on 6 November 1939:

"eine in Zwischenahn zur Zieldarstellung gestartete W34 mit 3 Mann Besatzungn ist von der Flak, sdl. von Hamburg, um 2147 Uhr abgeschossen worden.
Die Besatzung hatte offensichtlich die Orientierung verloren und sich am südlichen Stadtrand von Hamburg aufgehalten.
Um 2120 Uhr und 2124 Uhr erhält die Maschine deutsches Flakfeuer und schießt deutsche Erkennungssignale. Um 2125 wird die W34 von einem Scheinwerferkegel erfaßt und um 2131 einwandfrei als deutsch gemeldet. Um 2133 Uhr wird sogar das Balkenkreuz erkannt. Trotzdem erhält die Maschine um 2142 Uhr nochmals Flakfeuer. Um 2147 Uhr gehen drei Besatzungsmitglieder mit dem Fallschirm zur Erde nieder und wurden in ein Krankenhaus eingeliefert.
"

Google traduction (too lazy (and sick...) today to do better):
"one is in Zwischenahn for target simulation started with three men W34 Besatzungn by flak, sdl from Hamburg, was shot at 2147 Clock.
The crew had apparently lost their way and stayed on the southern outskirts of Hamburg.
To 2120 and 2124 Clock Clock, the machine is replaced by German antiaircraft fire and shoots German recognition signals. To 2125, the W34 is caught by a spotlight at 2131 and fully reported as German. 2133 Clock To even the cross bar is detected. Nevertheless, the machine is replaced by 2142 Clock flak again. 2147 Clock To go with three crew members parachuted to the ground and were taken to hospital."

Source:
http://www.luftfahrtspuren.de/forum/viewtopic.php?t=61

No other data, to check with people having German 1939 loss lists

Best regards

Laurent
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  #548  
Old 28th April 2010, 19:35
Brian Brian is offline
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Re: Friendly fire WWII

Many thanks once again, Laurent.

Excellent - another 'new' one for me!

Cheers
Brian
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  #549  
Old 30th April 2010, 00:52
FlyNavy FlyNavy is offline
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Re: Friendly fire WWII

Hello Brian,

I joined recently and noticed two FAA-related friendly fire incidents mentioned in some of the earliest posts in this thread. I may have some information of interest:

28 May 1940: two Skuas 806 Sqn FAA reported attacks by Curtiss off Dunkerque.

Although Sturtivant does mention French Curtiss as attackers, White Section of 806 Sqn (less one aircraft, which had crashed on take-off from Manston) was attacked by RAF Spitfires, according to 806 Sqn. survivors (e.g., see the 'Skua' book by Smith).
The only source giving a few details on the attackers is Air Enthusiast Issue no. 8: Green and Swanborough mention 66 Squadron Spitfires and report that stories of 'Voughts' (V-156Fs), supposedly in German hands, circulated as an explanation for the incident.

24/7/40: Two Skuas 808 Squadron shot down by Spitfires from 610 Squadron. Serial numbers of Skuas? Both force-landed at Worthy Down.

808 Sqn. was formed with 12 Fulmars in July 1940, not Skuas. Fulmar serial numbers are given by Sturtivant and there are two or three aircraft that seemingly have no history after delivery to 808 Sqn.
Do you have any details on this incident?

Best Regards
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  #550  
Old 30th April 2010, 12:53
Brian Brian is offline
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Re: Friendly fire WWII

Hi FlyNavy

Yes, I have. My research has different conclusions as will be seen in Volume I of Flying Sailors at War, hopefully to appear in June.

If you are desperate for the information, however, send me a PM

Cheers
Brian
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