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Old 16th November 2010, 18:04
Laurent Rizzotti Laurent Rizzotti is offline
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Lt Horst Hannig, 28 Sep 1942

On 28 September 1942, Lt Horst Hannig of 5./JG 54:

_ claimed a Yak-1 shot down at 10h05 in Pl.Qu 18411 (his 78th victory). The precise location is Pl.Qu. 35 Ost/18411, ie 57°44 N 31°31 E, SSE of Staraja Russa. See http://www.mapquest.com/maps?l=57.736112&g=31.527776

_ force-landed near Andronowo (German spelling) after the engine of his fighter was hit in an air battle, wrecking (80% damage) his Bf 109 G-2 WNr 10366 in the process.

I'm searching confirmation that both these events happened in the same battle.

There is a place called Andronovo south of Staraja Russa (see http://www.maplandia.com/russia/novg...yon/andronovo/), that is 10-15 km west of the place of Hannig's claim. So it is possible that he was hit in the battle, turned west towards his base/German lines and then force-landed.

But I will still like to have a narrative account of the battle, or another proof both events are linked.

Thanks in advance.

Laurent
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Old 16th November 2010, 18:38
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ouidjat ouidjat is offline
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Re: Lt Horst Hannig, 28 Sep 1942

Bonsoir Laurent,

Perhaps a little bit out of subject.
The kracker list and JG54 lost list are giving two losses on that day:
Oblt. Dieball, OT, flying WNr.10366 shot down nearby Andronovo
and
Horst Hannig flying a Yellow 4 (say in 6./JG54), no WNr. specification and location unknown...

Regards, Franck.
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Old 16th November 2010, 19:44
Laurent Rizzotti Laurent Rizzotti is offline
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Re: Lt Horst Hannig, 28 Sep 1942

Hi Franck,

AFAIK the Kracker list is using Gunter Rosipal's loss list as one of his source.

Rosipal has two losses this day for II./JG 54 while the Luftwaffe loss summary had only one.

My source to say that Hannig was the pilot of WNr 10366 at Andronovo is the book of Jochen Prien and co, "Die Jagdfliegerverbände der deutschen Luftwaffe 1934 bis 1945, Vol 9/3". It is more up to date than Rosipal's list.
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Old 16th November 2010, 19:50
Leo Etgen Leo Etgen is offline
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Leutnant Horst Hannig 28 September 1942

Hi guys

Prien has the following regarding this incident:

28 September 1942: Bf 109 G-2 (W.Nr. 10 366) flown by Leutnant Horst Hannig of 5./JG 54, involuntary ground contact during aerial combat at Andronowo, 80%

One source that I have seen states that possibly his opponent in this engagement was S/Lt Smolnikov of 402 IAP, VVS but I have no idea on what information this is based upon nor how accurate it is.

Horrido!

Leo
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Old 16th November 2010, 21:46
Laurent Rizzotti Laurent Rizzotti is offline
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Re: Lt Horst Hannig, 28 Sep 1942

It seems that the source for the Hannig vs Smolnikov battle was the Russian author Valery Dymich, that some years issued a text linking Soviet successes with JG 54 losses, "Fun hunting in the Eastern Europe". Christer Bergström made a comment on it and posted it on his site, showing that many German losses described by Dymich were either misdated, or scores of german pilots lost were greatly increased. So I would say that according to this the source may be not very reliable.

On the other hand, both the text and its comment seem to have disappeared from the Internet. I was only able to find a Spanish translation of it (http://www.rkka.es/Otros_articulos/2...1_arcitulo.htm).

Here is an automatic translation in English of the passage about 28 Sep 1942:
"There is no doubt about who knocked the German expert of the month before last. On 28 September, at least eight of the II Bf.109G. and III. / JG 54 escorting Junkers of KG 3 when they encountered four Soviet fighters (two Yak-1 of 402 º IAP and two P-40E of the 630 º IAP PVO) which in turn covered with a formation of Il-2 . The results were mixed: in an unusual exaggeration German airmen claimed Soviet fighters shoot down seven (three more than they really were!) With the expert Leutnant Hans-Joachim Heyer knocking down the P-40E Chebotaryov Nikolay and his partner making Heinrich Sterr same with the other Kittyhawk flown by Nikolay Dolenko (both German pilots had claimed two victories each, and both Soviet airmen jumped and landed safely.) But one of the pilots of Yak-1, Leitenant Starshiy Smolnikov, returned the courtesy forcing the expert Leutnant Horst Hannig (6./JG 54) to jump from his burning Bf.109G-2, while his ace with tovarish 16 wins Starshiy Leitenant Dmitryevich Lijobabin Ivan struck down the Ju.88A-4 of Leutnant Immo Riebeck (1./KG 3) - all the crew perished. Lijobabin in fact probably shot down by a second Junkers who never filed a formal complaint, as the Luftwaffe lost a second Ju.88 during that fight. This was the second time Hannig was shot down over Russian soil, the first was on 17 March 1942. Hannig would be credited with 90 victories on the Eastern Front, and perish on May 15, 1943 on France, serving in the JG 2 Richthofen, a British Spitfire fighter hands when his account amounted to 98 victories."

By the way, the fight where JG 54 pilots claimed seven victories (5 Lagg-3 and two Il-2) was between 1300 and 1315 hrs, three hours after Hannig victory (registered at 1005 hrs), but in the same area.
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Old 16th November 2010, 22:07
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Re: Lt Horst Hannig, 28 Sep 1942

You might try a PM to Andrey Dikov as that area of the Eastern Front dealing with JG54 and the VVS has been researched by him.
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Old 17th November 2010, 11:51
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Re: Lt Horst Hannig, 28 Sep 1942

Hi there,
@Laurent & Leo; thank you both for your comments/help.
Cheers, Franck.
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