Japanese camouflage late war

[keith A]

In many accounts the Japanese aircraft are described as as mottled brown/green or muddy brown. However I have rarely seen a full colour artwork that reflects this. Most are mottled dark green/silver metal or flat matt dark green. Is the impression of "brown" just the sun reflecting off a green aircraft surface?

regards

Keith

[Buckeye30]

Hi Keith. Not many as you say, this is from Nick Millman's "Oscar Collection" he is a very well-respected author and illustrator ( though the caption says MAY be 2 shades of green); there are several in his OSPREY books on IJAAF aces with profiles by Ronnie Olsthoorn but they are green uppersurfaces with dark brown mottle over them, not quite the same. Typically the unpainted airframe shows through.

Can't post here but but you might like to PM me your e-mail if you havn't seen them.
Regards
Nick


https://j-aircraft.com/drawings/nick...7th_sentai.htm

[keith A]

Cheers Nick, I have ALL the Osprey Japanese titles (I tend towards over-enthusiastic purchasing when I get a bee in my bonnet) and have looked everywhere on the 'net for evidence of brown camouflage. The overwhelming evidence is that the 'planes were painted green. I did wonder if the Japanese Navy and Air Force adopted different camouflage choices but again that fell flat in the face of almost all the profiles I have seen. There are a few examples of brown camo but not anywhere near the amounts that would match the USN claims of brown or brown/green mottling in the period 1944-45. I wonder, would constant exposure to the sun bleach green aeroplanes brown?

best regards

Keith

[Graham Boak]

Wasn't the standard colour an olive green, which is well known for being on the borders of green and brown, and often fades browner? The IJAAF had a brown in use earlier, and there seems to be no reason why it could not have continued in use - whether it did or not as a general statement, there would seem to be no reason to rule it out completely at all times. Another reason for colour changes is the shortage of particular pigments in siege economies, something discussed in terms of the German paints but not (to my knowledge) for the Japanese. It wasn't just the oil that wasn't getting through to the homeland.

I would argue that most of the evidence on the net are profiles, and we should all be aware of how unreliable they are! I certainly recall profiles of Ki.100 in brown, with references to it being common on late-war types. There are however other sources than Osprey, especially in Japanese publications. Though there is of course no reason to expect to older ones not so suffer from the same misunderstandings of the official colours as those in the West.

Without being able to access my copy at the moment, is there not evidence of browns in Thorpe? I know that Nick Millman finds these particular elderly works reliable - perhaps surprisingly so.

[keith A]

Olive green seems a distinct possibility. It definitely looks on the cusp of green and brown.

regards

Keith

[bearoutwest]

Originally Posted by Graham Boak

.......Without being able to access my copy at the moment, is there not evidence of browns in Thorpe? I know that Nick Millman finds these particular elderly works reliable - perhaps surprisingly so.

Graham,
Thorpe denotes the following browns in his JAAF Color Chart:
A11 - Dark Brown (colour patch shows a lot of dark green/brown)
A12 - Medium Brown
A13 - Red Brown
A14 - Light Earth (colour patch is a light tan)
A20 - Weathered Red (colour patch shows dark brown with a red tinge)

Any thoughts about how accurate Donald W. Thorpe's work is?

Regards, ...geoff

[edwest2]

See post #62 here:


https://ww2aircraft.net/forum/thread...ge.9317/page-4

[Graham Boak]

Nick Millman, currently the go-to source in English for Japanese camouflage, has a high opinion of Thorpe's work. I think you'd have to go study his blogs to find if he has addressed the problem of browns. However, he did assist Colourcoats with their Japanese colours, and having used the resulting late war olive green paint (see the Sovereign Hobbies website for a representation) I have to say that it looks green on my model, if somewhat more brown than most representations. I've no idea how it would fade, as this would depend upon the pigments. The UK (and presumably other Allies) found green pigments in short supply, but whether this was true for the IJN I don't know. I would assume so, given the effectiveness of the blockade.

[keith A]

Just found this site

http://www.ww2wrecks.com/portfolio/i...-aircraft-154/

The upper surfaces seem to show as Olive green/brown.

regards

Keith

[keith A]

This image seems to show olive green/brown upper surfaces. I am definitely leaning towards this being the brown colours seen on the Japanese aircraft in 1945.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/2d/31...ed97cfcc96.jpg