Fw 190 V25 / Ta 152 prototype in soviet hands

[ChristianK]

Gentlemen,
I just stumbled across an interesting photo of derelict Fw 190/Ta 152 GH+KO, with some soviet soldiers in the foreground:

http://modelforum.cz/viewtopic.php?f...2062&start=495
(last photo on this page)

Now I understand that this is a former Fw 190 A-0, converted into a Ta 152 prototype later in the war. Any idea were this photo might have been taken? And do we have others of the same plane in its final configuration?

Cheers,
Christian

[stukapilot]

this foto might b a fake one. here's the related link
www.klueser.eu/Fw190.php#fnv305
notice this sentence:

Vorgesehen für Erprobung Ta 152H, aber nicht fertig gestellt

planned for testing Ta-152 H, but not finished

and another russian guy also doubts if it's genuine.
http://pyrcus.livejournal.com/561840.html
he posted this foto with a reply below:

У меня есть подозрение, что солдатики вклеены в отчётную фотку "фрицев". Дело в том, что этот Фокевульф был разбит немцами во время испытаний в октябре 1944-го хз, как далеко от линии фронта. И у меня огромное сомнение, что он мог проваляться без дела до весны 45-го

i have a doubt that those soldiers were (processed) "glued" into the report picture of "Fritz". the fact is that this Focke-Wulf was damaged by the Germans during the tests in october 1944 and how far away was it from the front line. i greatly doubt that it could have lain idled until spring 1945
regards

[ChristianK]

Thanks Pilot for the original link! So this other guy thinks this is photoshopped? Might be so, as this was not so uncommon in the Soviet Union in the 30s-40s - but the plane in the background definitely was not photographed immediately after its crash (So not a photo from a LW crash report). There are too many parts missing. I bet it was found by the Soviets in this condition somewhere in East Germany..but where? Rechlin? Cottbus?

[stukapilot]

u'r right, Christian, they believe that this foto is PS-edited. the background is from another foto while those soviet soldiers with medals decorated r made up onto it from another foto. they tries to find the origins of 2 fotos but no more clues found. that's what i can concluded from their conversation below.

[RolandF]

I think the fake might have been done with the StKz. The charcters are too big sand too thin. The characters used by Focke Wulf for late-war prototypes are o nly slightly larger than the horizontel Balkenkreuz bar but thicker in proportion. Just compare Fw 190D and Ta 152 prototypes.

Regards
RolandF

[Von Alles]

The wing tip looks more than a A/D model rather than a Ta152H ?

[ChristianK]

Prototypes often had the standard wings. And regarding the question whether the Stkz is fake ... naaa, I don't know. Looks too realistic for me. There is only one detail that could bug me, however: That the tail wheel is still in place on this rather derelict bird...But honestly, I think this is a real photo (at least of the plane in the background) ..

[Harold Lake]

I believe this photo is significant inasmuch as it shows the remains of the Fw 190 V25, W.Nr. 0050, GH+KO, possibly near Tarnewitz. I could be wrong, but I don't recall ever seeing a photo of the V25 before. My file for the V25 states that it was mainly used as a engine and armament development aircraft. Apparently it tested several engines including the DB 603A, Jumo 213A and C. It also participated in MK 108 and MK 103 motor-cannon testing. The fuselage was lengthened by 500mm and it retained its original 18.3m square wing. It is also possible it was somehow connected with cabin pressure testing. The fuselage stkz, GH+KO, looks authentic and, is correct for the V25. I can find no evidence the V25 was ever associated with the Ta 152.

Hal

[ChristianK]

Hi Harold, thanks for your input!
In fact, the website stammkennzeichen.de has another photo of GH+KO, taken right after a crash and here it looks like the plane was one of the DB 603 high-altitude-testbeds. It's marking style is different here, perhaps the plane was repainted after the crash (the supercharger, longer exhaust stacks etc. seem to have been removed too).. a mysterious bird indeed ...

[Harold Lake]

Christian,
So that's the same airplane! Interesting. I know I have seen this image before. Now, I remember. Griehl, Nowarra and Heumann have each used essentially the same photo taken after a rather nasty looking crash...only each have ID'd the aircraft as the Fw 190 V31 because they were convinced the last letter must be a "U." They apparently just never considered the possibility this letter was actually an "O." Understandable I suppose. But nowadays, we are not so anxious to claim something...so, thank you for exposing this myth.

Hal