He 111 P-4

[Pawel Burchard]

Were He 111 P-4's so called Neubauflugzeuge or refurbished (Umbau) He 111 P-2's?

best regards,
Paweł

[Seaplanes]

According to a document dated 1. November 1942 "Baureihenzusammenstellung der in der Luftwaffe eingeführte und in Einführung begriffenen Flugzeugmuster", the He 111P-4 was the same as the He 111H-4 except for the engines that was 2 x DB 601A in stead of the H-4's 2 x Jumo 211D. I would imagine that this was not an "Umbau" but normal series aircraft.

[Pawel Burchard]

Thank you Seaplanes. I found very little loss reports for operational bomber P-4 examples and mainly from K.G. 55 (possibly also K.G. 4), there is no single example in Waiss' K.G. 27 monograph (all P-2's). And so production of this version should have been small.

p.

[G.R.Morrison]

We have over 200 P-4s listed on our db, about sixty with the KG 4, over one hundred with the KG 55. They were still being used as late as 1944 in the B-Schulen.

As to the few that were with the KG 27, they were being used by the IV Gruppe in June/July/Aug. 1942.

Hope this helps, GRM

[Pawel Burchard]

Thank you GRM.

Regards,
Paweł

[Dénes Bernád]

Hungary reportedly also had a couple of P-4s, although I don't have their WNr. to positively prove the identity.

[Norbert Schuchbauer]

Just FYI,
the P-2 and H-2 were converted to the P-4 and H-4 to allow them to carry Luftminen (Air mines). The source document is the "Übersichtsliste der Änderungs-Anweisungen He 111, Ernst Heinkel Flugzeugwerke GmbH Seestadt Rostock."

Regards,
Norbert

[Denniss]

German Bundesarchive data also claims the P-4 was a pure Umbau (conversion) version with 156 converted.
The amount of converted H-4 may be incomplete there, listing a minimum of 117.

[Seaplanes]

Having looked through the Änderungsanweisungen for He 111 (held by Deutsches Museum in München) and Beschaffungsmeldung Stand vom 29.2.1940 (BA/MA RL3/186) the whole He 111P production and conversions are more confusing than ever. In the comments for the February 1940 production report the following is mentioned regarding He 111P: Die in der Spalte Bemrkungen aufgeführten 27 Umbauflugzeuge werden von P3 auf P4 umgerüstet. Can someone clarify the situation ? Finally, to Denniss, when giving comments, please quote your references.

[Pawel Burchard]

Of interest are also external bomb racks fitted to P-4's. I am aware of only one more or less clear photo of them (Manfred Griehl's He 111 monograph, Motorbuch) and they seem to be much smaller than similar ones seen on He 111 Hs.

p.