1939: a stunning Bf 109 E-3 flown by... St.G 7 !

[Marc-André Haldimann]

Hi there Gang,

Thanks to Falcon who drew my attention to this picture, here a tough nut to crack - or not?. This eBay pic, found by Tomas Prusa, shows us a Bf 109 E-3 in its typical 1939 camouflage, sporting proudly a 6./St.G. 77 emblem! Any informations about this machine? Was it a Staffel hack?

Thanks in advance!
Marc

[Larry Hickey]

Hello,

This is very definitely a standard 6./StG77 insignia, which began being applied to unit Ju87B-1s about Sept., 1939, around the beginning of the war. Never seen a StG77 insignia on a Bf109. Almost makes me wonder if someone isn't playing a little Photoshop joke. It is easy enough to create such an image with this program.

I know that this is for sale on eBay, so we'll have to see what develops.

Regards,

[Marc-André Haldimann]

Thanks Larry for your swift answer... I must confess I didn't think at Photoshop for a second. To my eyes, it looks darn authentic... Ah the modern world! Looking for the developments.

Thanks again and cheers
Marc

[Falcon]

Marc, it don't must be an E-3. You can see the hatch for the MG 17 access on the wing. In combination with the early canopy I think an E-1 is more possible in my opinion.

The picture don't looks like a Photoshop manipulation. There are no typical artefacts around the emblem... very clean photo.

Btw, the Stab/St.G. 77 got Bf 109's from 31.3.41 to 6.41... source:
http://www.ww2.dk/air/attack/stg77.htm

[Larry Hickey]

Hello,

See my posting "PHOTO FRAUD ALERT" that I just posted on this board. I can't say for sure that this specific photo is a fraud, but today I saw another one where "the collar didn't match the cuff," to use an old saying. It was, without doubt, a Photoshop fraud. No question in that case.

More info to follow as I gather more information on this.

[ouidjat]

Hi Guys,

@Falcon; Stab St.G 77 Bf109s, maybe, but not 6./St.G 77 - as far indicated in Michael Hom's site.

And I'm afraid I do agree with Larry. Structure détails are too much outlined, specially around Karmann and the vertical panel line doesn't appear when crossing the emblem, though it's readable at the bottom and at the top.

The undercarriage bump fairing looks like it has been drawn with a graphite pencil.

Sorry David, I cannot back you on this one.

@Larry; Think you're right with that fraud alert. I did start to look for original picture, without emblem, of course.

Last about fraud.
With time, the more I'm considering that last -quite a long time ago now - Bf109k-4 picture, with tulip, the more I'm thinking it's a fake too...

Regards, Franck.

[ouidjat]

Hi Gents,

I'm back ...
This morning there was a link on eBay.de; the habitual thumbnail ... Now it's not there anymore ... Am I right? Can I have the original link please?

Regards, Franck.

[Larry Hickey]

Hello again,

The eBay connection for the photo with the "suspect" 6./StG77 insignia has been posted on the LEMB. I see that the seller claims that this is an original print. The other photo that I refer to in my "fraud warning" posting isn't just a case of the "collar not matching the cuff" but was an outright, high-quality fraud. It was, however, sold as a modern reproduction of a WW II original photo. This one isn't being represented that way. I can't be sure that the 6./StG77 photo is a fraud, but it certainly isn't consistent with expectations, especially with the certain insignia fraud item turning up almost simultaneously. However, if the Bf109E photo with the 6./StG77 insignia turns out to be authentic, is would certainly be unique and might command a high price at auction. So, until we know otherwise, the seller here should be given the benefit of the doubt. However, the issue remains the same since the other item was, without question, a forgery and was sold as an authentic image. If I can get permission from the holder of the other photo, I will post both the forgery and the original photos that prove it so so all can see what can be done with Photoshop--just in case you don't already know.

Regards,

Larry Hickey
EoE Project Coordinator

[Jochen Prien]

Looking at the image with the "photoshop issue" in mind, it strikes me that the emblem appears unusually clean compared with the surrounding parts of the fuselage side which are covered with exhaust soot along the wing root. Only the emblem seems to have been wiped clean. Definitely no poof of a forgery for sure, only a source for scepticism, so as Larry put it, the seller should be given the benefit of the doubt.

KR

Jochen Prien

[harrison987]

I have been working on photoshop for a looooooooooooooooong time...and I am 99% sure that this specific image is good. My feeling is that it is a staged photo. It was not a case of, "ah let's take a photo"...they specifically wanted an pic of the emblem, and ground crew at work. As such, the emblem was cleaned to look good, a mechanic/wart was asked to make it look like he was working on the plane...and the photo was taken.

I do not see any issues or descrepancies with this image...but I do suspect it is a wartime re-print. It is quite grainy, similar to all the Russian reprints from their war archive...and there is a dark line at the top, not usually seen on original printed pics .