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  #11  
Old 21st August 2006, 15:43
vzlion vzlion is offline
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Re: JG information needed

Thank you very much. Very complete explination. Thank you for the explination and the posting.

Walt
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  #12  
Old 21st August 2006, 20:39
Franek Grabowski Franek Grabowski is offline
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Re: JG information needed

Andreas
Have you compared those data against individual loss returns?
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  #13  
Old 22nd August 2006, 07:13
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Andreas Brekken Andreas Brekken is offline
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Re: JG information needed

Hi, Franek.

Yes I have. They are mostly one to one if no clerical error is involved.

I mostly use the Summarische Verlustemeldungen to get a brief overview of what losses a unit has sustained, what losses were recorded on a specific date or in a specific period of time, see for example screenshot below, where search criteria is losses for JG 5 between 01.10.1943 and 31.10.1943:



In my database all summary losses can be connected to a detailed loss record, and the script will then change the background color of the number of aircraft column and making this into a link that will show the appropriate loss when clicked on. Here they are blue, indicating that the corresponding detailed loss information is available in the database.

I have also used the records to make statistical overviews of losses.

Regards,
Andreas
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  #14  
Old 22nd August 2006, 16:46
Franek Grabowski Franek Grabowski is offline
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Re: JG information needed

Hello Andreas
So I understand that these monthly returns were prepared at RLM based on GQ6 returns for some statistical purposes. I would say, perspective of filing some gaps in 1944 is very tempting. May I have a couple of questions by PM?
Anyway, we are still lacking a completely different set of losses than a compilation of GQ6. Is there no technical diary of any of the unit available?
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  #15  
Old 23rd August 2006, 13:15
RT RT is offline
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Re: JG information needed

GQ6 is far to be so worst as you are thinking, recouped with NVM is
"quite ""perfect, troubles is with locations nd sometimes the causes,
for med.area difficult to say sometimes if the dates given are those of the "accident" or the one of the report, minor casualties could missed, but in a whole the one is interested with the losses hv to begin with the GQ6, it give him-her / not so much/ the basic frame up to him to complete as bette as he can
for 1939/1940 the documents produced by Andreas, are not so clear but they exist

remi
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  #16  
Old 23rd August 2006, 13:30
Franek Grabowski Franek Grabowski is offline
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Re: JG information needed

Remi
I have a direct comparison of RAF loss lists and documents. Indeed, the losses missing from GQ6 may be substantial, though most of them would be in damaged category.
I have no doubt that Andreas' work is neccesary but I doubt if it will get close to the reality without another sets of documents.
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  #17  
Old 24th August 2006, 13:05
RT RT is offline
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Re: JG information needed

Franek

may we hv just a little sample ????

remi
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  #18  
Old 25th August 2006, 01:32
Franek Grabowski Franek Grabowski is offline
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Re: JG information needed

Remi
What do you mean by sample? A complete set of material losses of PAF 1940-47 (equivalent of GQ6 records) does mention only one loss of Polish Fighting Team, the one in which pilot was lost. Actually, there were some more aircraft lost, due to combat and non-combat damages. Also there were substantial inaccuracies.
In regard of more general sample - please reffer to 2 TAF volumes - authors mention that non-British, RAF subordinated units sufferred more casualties. It should be read that due to more documents being available, it was possible to make a much more comprehensive research and to find more details than available to average British unit.
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  #19  
Old 25th August 2006, 13:11
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Re: JG information needed

Sorry, I hv understood that your examples refer to GQ6/ At least in the brit.docs you hv all fatal casualties ???
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  #20  
Old 30th December 2008, 06:05
Nick Veltjens Nick Veltjens is offline
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Re: JG information needed

My brother Unteroffizier Gerhard Veltjens, Richthofen Geschwader II, crashed trying to land his over-revving FW 190. It burst into flames, but he managed to crawl out. He died of burns a few days later: 8 April 1944. What was the actual date of the crash?
Nick
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