Hurricane captured at Derna 26.09.1941

[Ludovico Slongo]

Sorry I mean Andrei.
Ludovico

[Andrei Demjanko]

Ludovico,

Thanks a lot for this very interesting information! Much appreciated

[Gerry Bevan]

Hello

I have most of the ORB & Summary of Events for 2 PRU.

In addition to the information you have already, the Summary of Events indicate that F/Lt Brown collected a new Hurricane W9352 on the 29th Sept 1941 etc etc....

From this record, his loss was on the 2nd Oct 1941 & cannot be the 26th Sept 1941 ...

Hope this helps

Gerry

[Andrei Demjanko]

Hello Gerry

So in this ORB which you have must be the answer who force-landed on 26 September, because no other Hurricane-equipped units flew operations so far away from the frontline at this time. Would you be so kind to tell what ORB says about any Hurricane operations or losses on 26 September 1941?

[Gerry Bevan]

Hello Andrei

It seems that 2 PRU were set up from the 1st June 1941.

They were slowly building up the Unit & continuously pressing to get more aircraft.

As a result, on the 1st Sept 1941 they only had one operational Hurricane which was W9116, the Lockheed & the Beaufighter. They rec'd two "new" Hurricanes W9353 & Z4182 on the 1st Sept but these were then sent to 103 M.U to have cameras etc etc fitted and to be painted Blue.

The records state that they only undertook 5 Ops in Sept 1941 and all these were undertaken by W9116.

No Aircraft losses were reported for Sept 1941. The other Hurricanes mentioned above are mentioned undertaking Ops in Oct 1941 onwards....

Other useful information - 2 PRU started to operate from Fuka from the 1st Oct 1941.

F/Lt A.M.Brown brought Hurricane W9353 from Heliopolis to Fuka on the 1st Oct 1941. F/Lt Nicholson brought W9116.

On the 2nd Oct 1941, F/Lt Brown took off in W9116 at 08.50 hrs to undertake a recce of Benghazi, but did not return.

Hope this helps.

Gerry

[Gerry Bevan]

Hello Andrei

Just correcting a typing error in my post on the 14th April.

On the 29th Sept 1941 F/Lt Brown collected Hurricane W9353 from 103 M.U.

Best wishes

Gerry

[Stig Jarlevik]

Gerry

According to Air Britain No.2 PRU was formed 17.10.1940 at Heliopolis with Marylands. They had detachments both in Palestine and later Lebanon not to mention various places in the desert.

To me it rather looks like you are talking about the set up of one of these detachments (1.6.1941) in the desert, rather than the whole unit as such.

Thanks for quoting from the ORB for us.
Whatever force landed at Derna (if anything) on the 26th can't have been one of their Hurricanes.

Cheers
Stig

[Andrei Demjanko]

Gerry,

Many thanks for your very detailed and informative reply!

To sum it up:

There are several German and Italian reports of a force-landing of Hurricane on 26 September 1941

The aircraft of this type (Hurricane) could only be of 2 PRU. (And, thanks to information from ORB, provided by Gerry, we now know this could only be W9116)

The date F/Lt Brown was awarded the DFC is 26 September 1941

Against this we have ORB of 2 PRU which gives the date as 2 October (This date also mentioned in one Italian press release)

It is also interesting that new Hurricane was collected from 103 MU on 29 September (to replace the earlier loss of another one?)

Could it be that ORB of 2 PRU is not contemporary and reconstructed some time after the events? So the date when unit learned of F/Lt Brown's capture was recorded as the date of his loss? I know I'm on too thin ice now. But there are no other options for a loss on 26 September.

[Gerry Bevan]

Hi Stig

It was on a visit to the NA in 2010 whilst researching other units that I needed to look up some info on 2 PRU.

I discovered that I was given the "actual" ORB and not the usual micro-film, which was normal from this time onwards......

So I decided to focus on this unexpected opportunity & photographed the ORB myself.

Hopefully, I have managed to attach the first file to my post.

From this, you can read the introduction for 2 PRU.

I note that it eventually states that it was formed on the 17th March 1941.

Best wishes

Gerry

[Stig Jarlevik]

Thanks Gerry

The Air Britain book mentions the Intelligence Photographic Flight and the date 3.3.1941 when their three Hurricanes were absorbed by the 2 PRU.

I can't explain their specific dates (either 17.10.1941 and 3.3.1941) but it seems unlikely to have been taken out of the blue, especially since the details were changed from the first edition where it was stated that the 2 PRU was formed on 3.3.1941 by re-naming the Intelligence Photographic Flight!

Some other document must then be the basis for these specific dates and also for giving details about the Marylands.

Your document mentions both October 1940 and March 1941 so we are on the right track...I guess....

Cheers
Stig