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Old 18th November 2006, 17:29
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Losses? JG27 24 April, JG300 11 Sep 1944

Does anybody have the losses from these two units? Pretty certain JG27 was engaged in the Munich area on the 24th of April, 1944 and JG300 was engaged S of Kassel on the 11th of September.

So far it looks like the 355th engaged both JG3 and JG27 in the Munich area between 1340 and 1415 timeframe on 24 April 1944. It hurt one or both of these units pretty badly and in turn lost 3. So far, based on the times it looks like Bartels, Steigler and Engels got the 357FS 51's so JG27 is certainly a suspect for the 354FS engagement also.

It looks like the 354FS engaged JG 300 between Kassel and Marburg but harder to pinpoint whether it was JG300 unless it showed up with 9+ losses in this area?

If anyone is looking for 'probable' 355th FG victims I'm getting pretty close to matching times and locations to the Luftwaffe Victory tables thanks to the very knowledgable people on this forum as well as Tony Woods/Les Butler archives.

Thank you all

Regards,

Bill Marshall
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Old 18th November 2006, 18:57
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Re: Losses? JG27 24 April, JG300 11 Sep 1944

Bill, yes as an example II.Sturm and III./JG 300 were engaged with Mustangs and claimed victories south and southeast of Kassel. Fritzlar, Bad Hersfeld, Eschwege, Eisenach were some of the areas of engagement with the 109's/Fw 190A's.
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Old 18th November 2006, 19:34
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Re: Losses? JG27 24 April, JG300 11 Sep 1944

Bill - need any info on the 4 55th losses or 4 357th losses 4/24/44?
Mike
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Old 12th January 2007, 17:46
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Re: Losses? JG27 24 April, JG300 11 Sep 1944

Mike - I satnd corrected. I would like details of 357 losses on 4/24/44. The 357 and 355 were the primary shields for the B-17 Group that went astray at Munich in the 1330 - 1400 timeframe. The 55th was still flying 38's so they are easy to pick from the Luftwaffe claims list

I'm pretty sure based on Tony Woods work that either Bartels or Stieglar shot down Sturm around 1400+ and possibly Hillman and Norman in 1345-1410 timeframe - so I'm trying to eliminate LW claims related to other groups like the 357 and 4FG's

I'm also scrathing my head on who the 355th really hurt that day with 20 109 claims plus 9 damaged in the target area from Augsburg through Munich and back from S of target to the West. I looked at all the encounter reports and all were "exploded, pilots bailed out, crashed into ground' types with no particular claim that leaves room for speculation - so even if overstated - some outfit was hurt

Regards,

Bill
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Old 13th January 2007, 00:55
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Re: Losses? JG27 24 April, JG300 11 Sep 1944

About the 11. September 1944:
I./JG 76 suffered 14 Bf 109 losses with 7 (?) KIA in the Kassel-Eschwege area. I found the names of 4 KIA, 1 MIA and 4 WIA in combat with P-51 for this day. But it's hard to find any info about losses or missions of this unit...

Heuser
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Old 13th January 2007, 01:25
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Re: Losses? JG27 24 April, JG300 11 Sep 1944

Hi.

Regarding 24.04.1944

I am sorry I do not have the time to assist you with all details, but from my database, there are 62 losses due to enemy action in the day fighter units of the Luftwaffe on this date.

If you are interested I can post an overview of these here, as a basis for further research.

Regards,
Andreas B
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Old 13th January 2007, 01:28
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Re: Losses? JG27 24 April, JG300 11 Sep 1944

Heuser - this sounds like a probable match. Were the JG76 losses in the 1150-1215 timeframes (Brit time) S of Kassel, North of Wetzlar? The 355th axis of engagement - any specific pilots identified?

It looks like the 355th attacked approx 2 staffels S of Kassel and chased the Germans in a South to SE (Fritzlar to Bad Hersfeld) and South to SW (Fritzlar to Marburg) from Kassel. I doubt that the 354FS got as far as Eschege in 15 minutes so the downed 109s would be west of the Fritlar/Bad Hersfeld line.

Thanks so much - does it still seem like JG76 to you? Where were the JG53 losses.

Regards,
Bill
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Old 18th November 2006, 19:49
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Re: Losses? JG27 24 April, JG300 11 Sep 1944

The JG 27 book by Werner Girberg shows Fw .Heinz Gasch 5/27, Gef Friedrich Heilmann 4/27 and Uffz. Edmund Linhart 5/27 all killed on 24.4.44 on Homeland Defense.
The book on 111 & 1V/ JG 27 by Jochen Prien, Peter Rodeike and Gerhard Stemmer shows the following Bf 109 G6 losses on 24.4.44 Uffz Hans-Georg Kolberg 10/27 killed Munich area, Uffz. Clement Metzinger 11/27 killed near Munich, Uffz Josef Strumpf 11/27 killed and Ltn. Otto Engel 11/27 wounded in Munich area shot down by a P 51 and fired on at while on parachute,
Regards
Brian Bines
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Old 18th November 2006, 21:28
DDT DDT is offline
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Re: Losses? JG27 24 April, JG300 11 Sep 1944

J-Y LORANT & R.GOYAT's chronicle of JG 300 "Wilde Sau" returns the following losses :
5./JG 300 : Fw. Heinrich ARMBRECHT KIA after combat, Thurnhosbach/Eschwege; Lt. Richard HEEMSOTH KIA after combat 6 km NE Burghofen/Eschwege; Uffz. Traugott BAUMNN KIA after combat at Hessisch Lichtenau; Lt. Wolfgang Freiherr von Kap-Herr KIA after combat over Kirchhosbach; Fw. Konrad Bauer (w) after combat with P-51 emerg.landing at Nordhausen;
6./JG 300 : Uffz. Herbert LANG kia after combat near Weissenborn; Uffz. Josef DANKOWSKI KIA after combat, Langensalza;
7./JG 300 : Uffz. Walter Zeuner KIA after combat W. Renda near Eschwege; Uffz. Karl KAISER WIA Parachute jump after combat, Eisenach; Gefr. Emil HEIN KIA after combat w/P-51, Ulfen/Bebra S. Eschwege; Uffz. Friedrich ALTEN KIA after combat, Herleshausen; Ofw. Berthold Hemberger KIA after combat, Hessisch Lichtenau;
12./JG 300 : Lt. Ulrich Pieplow KIA emergency landing aftercombat, Diedenhofen;
3./JG 300 : Fw. Manfred SCHNEIDER MIA near Mackenrode, Fritzlar area; Lt. Karl-Heinz SEELER SAFE after belly landing, Frankenberg; Uffz. Berthold WENDLER SAFE after landing on 1 wheel at Rhein-Main airfield;
1./JG 300 : Uffz. Horst VÖLKERT WIA after parachute jump, Frankenau/Fritzlar area;
Regards,

Dirk
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Old 20th November 2006, 00:45
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Re: Losses? JG27 24 April, JG300 11 Sep 1944

Thank you all.

Regards,

Bill
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