English-French translation, request for assistance

[Recceswind]

I would like to make a request for French translation of the words listed below. I am interested in terms which were in use in France in 1940.

- ground command centre (responsible for ground controlled interceptions),
- a small unit consisting of 3 airplanes (in German it is Kette)? patrouille?
- commander (e.g. flight commander, squadron commander)
- oxygen installation
- unit [military unit]
- subunit

Thanks in advance!

[CJE]

- ground command centre: there was only one, which was exprimental, called "salle de filtrage".
- a small unit consisting of 3 airplanes: patrouille, 3 planes - patrouille légère, 2 planes - patrouille double, 6 planes - patrouille légère double, 4 planes, etc.
- commander: commandant d'escadrille, commandant de groupe, commandant d'escadre, etc.
- oxygen installation: système d'oxygène
- unit [military unit]: unité
- subunit: what do you mean?

[Recceswind]

Thanks! It looks a little bit complicated. So generally, units consisting of 2-6 airplanes are called "patrouille" - additional word is added (e.g. patrouille légère) only when we know number of the planes?

And one additional question: what was the name of the air defense observation points/stations (I mean such points/stations, which were helping own fighters to intercept advancing bombers; they were giving information about heading and altitude)?

Subunit - as far as I know, all military units larger than battalion are called "units". Everything smaller is a "sub-unit".

[Laurent Rizzotti]

Not exactly. At the start of the war the usual formation for French fighters was a 3-plane formation (called patrouille). These 3-plane formations could be combined to form 6 (2 * 3) or 9 (3 * 3) formation, respectively called "patrouille double" et "patrouille triple".

Bigger formations were usually described as combinations of the above, with for example a "patrouille triple" with a "patrouille double" as high cover, for a formation of 15 aircraft.

The patrouille légère was the name given to the formation with only 2 aircraft. As for the usual "patrouille", it was possible to combine them and form a "patrouille légère double" with 4 aircraft (2 * 2). AFAIK, there was no "patrouille légère triple" used, as the 6 aircraft will rather fly in two formations of 3 ("patrouille double").

The French équivalent of the Observer Corps in 1939-1940 was the "service de guet aérien" or "guet aérien".

Subunit: there is no such size distinction in France.

[CJE]

Merci Laurent.

The basic French Air Force (or armée de l'Air) unit was the "groupe".
A group was made of two "escadrilles" (squadrons), but they seldom fought independently.

[Recceswind]

Thank you Laurent! Names of the formations are clear now.

I would like to ask one more question concerning observer posts. Did they have direct radio communication with own fighters (in 1940)? If not, what is the correct French name of the posts/centres/stations which had such contact?

Which word should be used in a French sentence: "fighters took of from Chartres airfield"? aeroport? aerodrome? Which word should be used to name a military airfield?

[Laurent Rizzotti]

I have never read anything about a post of "guet aérien" able to use radio for direct contact with French fighters. Exemples I have seen is that the "guet aérien" was using phone to warm the airfield where fighters were based (either directly or through an Air Force HQ is not clear for me) and then fighters were scrambled. Once in the air, French pilots were usually on their own to find their targets.

For your second question, "aéroport" is rather used for a civilian/commercial airfield, and "aérodrome" will be OK for a military airfield, but the most used word in French military papers for airfield will be "terrain". "Aérodrome" may be used for peacetime bases with hard runways, while "terrain" may cover either them or wartime airfields using fields and so on. For big bases (like Villacoublay for instance), one can also find the expression "camp d'aviation".

May I ask if you want to translate English into French, or the other way ?

[CJE]

There were some "véhicules-radio" (radio cars) equipped with SARAMM radio sets which could send messages (provided they could stand on higher grounds) to the leader of a "patrouille", the only one that could tune into the radio-car transmission.
However, with no other assistance, these radio-cars gave a much limited support and their instructions were more often than not forgotten.

[Recceswind]

It will be rather uncommon translation: Polish to French. I suppose, that without my help, my translator would have serious problems with translations of the military terms.

Radio contact: I have several reports from 1940 with information about attacks of the French fighters - attacks which were coordinated from the ground by the observer posts ("ground stations"). During them pilots were receiving information about heading, altitude and number of German planes.

[CJE]

Originally Posted by Recceswind

Radio contact: I have several reports from 1940 with information about attacks of the French fighters - attacks which were coordinated from the ground by the observer posts ("ground stations"). During them pilots were receiving information about heading, altitude and number of German planes.

I wonder with what. We had only one radar in use and it worked like photoelectric cells - it could tell that "something" had crossed the beam, approximatively where, but not what, how many and how high. It was so trustworthy and useful that it was abandonned soon after May 10 when it became saturated by too high a number of aircraft flying past the beam.