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  #1  
Old 16th September 2008, 00:52
Kari Lumppio Kari Lumppio is offline
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3. Flieger-Division Ju 87 Gruppen bases Spring 1944 (Narva area)?

Salut!

Can anyone answer to the question of bases of the Ju 87 -Schlachtgruppen of 3. Flieger-Division. That is II/SG 1, Stab, I and II/SG 5 and I/SG 5? (Ref: http://www.ww2.dk/air/hq/3fldiv2.htm ).

Although the given reference has some bases it does not seem to jive with other information about the battles. During the Spring 1944 large battles were fought in Narva, Pskov and also Nevel area. The (ground) battles were most fierce in Narva area which was the hotspot of Eastern Front around April 1944. For that purpose bases like Tartu (Dorpat), Pskov and Dno are too far away. II/SG 1 is in the right area though (Tallinn-Laksberg & Rakvere (Wesenberg). But the Gruppe was supposed to be at Rovaniemi, there was an article about it in Luftwaffe in Focus?

Literature about ground battles in Narva area continuously refer Stukas being from Kuhmley unit (= SG 3). That would mean the unit was also transferred (to Tallinn or Rakvere (Wesenberg)?) from Tartu (Dorpat)?

I would guess the Ju 87 units in question were shuffled around according the needs of the frontline situation?

Does anyone have the Einsatzbereitshaftmeldungen for the units for the period say early February to mid April, 1944? If I have understood it right these would give the bases in 10 or so day intervals?

Flight logbooks might also given hints.

My primary interest is SG 3 if searching data for all the Ju 87 units in question means too much work.

I would use this information amongst other things to try fit some Bundesarchiv Ju 87 published photos into context of the ground battles. I do have some scattered written data from Finnish air observation logs and Heeresgruppe Nord KTB attachments, too. Combined with the knowledge of Ju 87 bases perhaps some new conclusions could be made.


Thanking in advance,
Kari


PS. My private message quota is full.
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  #2  
Old 11th August 2010, 22:04
Sharkers Sharkers is offline
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Re: 3. Flieger-Division Ju 87 Gruppen bases Spring 1944 (Narva area)?

Dear Kari,
there is an excellent book about I. / SG 3 DORPAT, which covers nearly most of the I./3 missions in march 1944 in the NARWA, PSKOV PLESKAU and OSTROFF area.
Fronteinsätze eines Stuka Fliegers, Helios Verlag Germany
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  #3  
Old 11th August 2010, 23:04
Kari Lumppio Kari Lumppio is offline
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Re: 3. Flieger-Division Ju 87 Gruppen bases Spring 1944 (Narva area)?

Hello!

Thanks for the response. I have the book now. Somewhere in middle of my mess of books... IIRC the book did not fully answer to my question about the bases. Should read it again.

Cheers,
Kari
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Old 12th August 2010, 00:15
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Nick Beale Nick Beale is offline
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Re: 3. Flieger-Division Ju 87 Gruppen bases Spring 1944 (Narva area)?

There are disposition maps at Freiburg (their title is something like "Aufmarsch der deutschen Luftwaffe an allen Fronten") in the KART40 series that might help you.
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Old 12th August 2010, 08:17
Kari Lumppio Kari Lumppio is offline
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Re: 3. Flieger-Division Ju 87 Gruppen bases Spring 1944 (Narva area)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick Beale View Post
There are disposition maps at Freiburg (their title is something like "Aufmarsch der deutschen Luftwaffe an allen Fronten") in the KART40 series that might help you.
Hello!

Exactly what I was looking back then when I sent my question (2008). The question has long since been on the backburner. Yet not forgotten.

A list of the Kart 40 so that one could order them from Bundesarchiv or somesuch would be very useful.

Regards,
Kari
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Old 12th August 2010, 12:43
yogybär yogybär is offline
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Re: 3. Flieger-Division Ju 87 Gruppen bases Spring 1944 (Narva area)?

Yes, such Maps from Kart40 would be a delight...

BTT:
For Fliegerdivision 3 in Feb-May'44, I can find these Stuka units (not all for all teh time..):
II./SG1, Stab SG 3, I/SG 3, II/SG 3, I/SG 5
(didn't count in 10./SG3 on purpose)
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Old 12th August 2010, 14:35
Sharkers Sharkers is offline
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Re: 3. Flieger-Division Ju 87 Gruppen bases Spring 1944 (Narva area)?

As far as I understood your primary interest is SG 3 in the NARWA area. Below you will find a list with missions of I. / SG 3 DORPAT flown in March 1944 in the NARWA, PSKOV and OSTROW area. I am also very interested in this subject and would be happy to get more information on the Stuka missions.


1. 28.02.1944 0805-0950 Area POLOZK
2. 03.03.1944 1200-1300 Area POLOZK
3. 03.03.1944 1425-1520 Area POLOZK
4. 04.03.1944 1430-1545 Area POLOZK
5. 07.03.1944 1200-1300 RADOVELI
6. 07.03.1944 1400-1500 OMUTI
7. 08.03.1944 1445-1610 ODRASAARE
8. 09.03.1944 0800-0925 VAVILOVKA
9. 09.03.1944 1035-1205 SAHONJE
10. 09.03.1944 1415-1515 RAZGOVOROVO LYABOLI
11. 10.03.1944 0630-0755 STEPASHI
12. 10.03.1944 0945-1105 ROGOVO – PANEVO
13. 10.03.1944 1230-1330 ZHIDILOV BOR
14. 19.03.1944 0615-0750 Stalinorgeln ne NARWA
15. 19.03.1944 0845-1015
16. 24.03.1944 0640-0800 VAIVARA / Estland
17. 26.03.1944 0525-0650 Westsack
18. 26.03.1944 0750-0915 Westsack
19. 26.03.1944 1005-1125 Westsack
20. 26.03.1944 1250-1410 Westsack
21. 26.03.1944 1515-1630 Westsack
22. 28.03.1944 1045-1205
23. 28.03.1944 1530-1710
24. 29.03.1944 0610-0735
25. 29.03.1944 0830-0945
26. 29.03.1944 1105-1220
27. 29.03.1944 1345-1500
28. 29.03.1944 1600-1715
29. 30.03.1944 0520-0645 Welikaya River
30. 30.03.1944 1040-1210 Welikaya River

3./SG 3 Dorpat
1. 07.03.1944 0940-1050 70 Sasseko ?
2. 15.03.1944 1000-1100 60 Funlekowo?
3. 15.03.1944 1155-1305 70 Funlekowo?
4. 19.03.1944 0620-0750 90 NARWA
5. 19.03.1944 1225-1355 90 GEDOFF A/F
6. 19.03.1944 1500-1645 105 Vaivara
7. 22.03.1944 1610-1710 60 Seredejewo
8. 24.03.1944 0640-0820 100 VAIVARA
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Old 12th August 2010, 15:14
Sharkers Sharkers is offline
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Re: 3. Flieger-Division Ju 87 Gruppen bases Spring 1944 (Narva area)?

Here are some of the locations / Targets of I./3:



Russia March 1944 – Targets of I. SG 3
Location ID number – LOCATION – Map (Scale and Sheet), Goggle Earth and UTM Reference

52 RADOVELI 40 Km sw of NARWA
Map 1:50.000 N701 Sheet 4236 II UTM 35V NF 498 495
59°04´54´´N 27°52´11´´E

53 OMUTI 34 Km sw of NARWA
Map 1:50.000 N701 Sheet 4236 II UTM 35V NF 475 559
59°07´57´´N 27°49´18´´E

54 ODRASAARE 5 Km ne of NARWA 3 Km n of SAHONJE
Map 1:50.000 N701 Sheet 4336 IV

55 VAVILOVKA 5,5 Km sw UST LUGA
Map 1:50.000 N701 Sheet 4337 III UTM 35V NG 66 10
Target in MC3a Planquadrat 8035 (1°x1°) = 59°37´31´´N 28°09´53´´E

56 SAHONJE 4 Km e of NARWA
Map 1:50.000 N701 Sheet 4336 IV 2 Km e of IVANGOROD
UTM 35V NF 715 835 59°23´ 05´´N 28°15´30´´E

57 RAZGOVOROVO – LYABOLI 2,75 Km ne of ZHIDILOV BOR
Map 1:50.000 N701 Sheet 4333 IV UTM 35V NE 719 238

58 STEPASHI 7,5 Km e of PANEVO
Map 1:50.000 N701 Sheet 4333 II UTM 35V ND 913 789
57°32´ N 28°31´ E

59 ROGOVO – PANEVO 28 Km sse of PLESKAU 26 Km nne of OSTROW
Map 1:50.000 N701 Sheet 4333 II UTM 35V ND 856 828
57°34´40´´ N 28°26´03´´E

60a ZHIDILOV BOR 14 Km nw of PLESKAU
Map 1:50.000 N701 Sheet 4333 IV UTM 35V NE 699 215
57°55´32´´N 28°11´6´´E

60 HIGH 55,8 1000m se of ZHIDILOV BOR UTM 35V NE 711 209


63 VAIVARA / Estland, south of SILLAMÄE und west NARWA

68 WESTSACK, 10 Km south of SILLAMÄE und 20 Km west of NARWA

78 UTKINO 35 Km se of OSTROW
Map 1:50.000 N701 Sheet 4432 III UTM 35V PD 055 301
57°06´28´´N 28°44´20´´E
3 Km east of VASILEVSKOYE
near CHERTOVA GORA Lake Strechno

Last edited by Sharkers; 12th August 2010 at 16:24.
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  #9  
Old 26th November 2011, 15:15
philippe1 philippe1 is offline
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Re: 3. Flieger-Division Ju 87 Gruppen bases Spring 1944 (Narva area)?

hello Kari,
i have tried to send you a PM but your box is full , can you make some space please?
phil
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  #10  
Old 26th November 2011, 15:45
Kari Lumppio Kari Lumppio is offline
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Re: 3. Flieger-Division Ju 87 Gruppen bases Spring 1944 (Narva area)?

Salut Philippe!

I sent my e-mail addres to you as PM. Hope to hear from you.


Hi Sharkers!

I have completely overlooked your response last year! It must have splipped past my eyes during the holidays. Please accept my apology and belated thanks.

Have you compiled the mission list from HGr Nord KTB or somesuch? It has Luftflotte 1 Luftlagemeldungen for the Spring 1944 period. I would love to find similar for the Summer (June-September) but AFAIK the KTB attachements are not held in the archives (in West, at least).


Cheers,
Kari
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