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Old 4th June 2019, 02:02
Karoband Karoband is offline
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"Oblique armament" on a KG 51 Me 262?

Good evening,

From British report BT 5797 issued on 26 2339z/2/45 citing Reference CX/MSS/T. 472/49:

"(STRONG INDICATIONS GIEBELSTADT £ GIEBELSTADT ))
ELEMENTS) KING FIVE ONE AFTERNOON TWENTYTHIRD REPORTED
ARRIVAL FROM LECHFELD £ LECHFELD OF ONE AIRCRAFT WITH
ONE FIVE DEGREES DEPRESSION OF THE OBLIQUE ARMAMENT,
AND ENQUIRED WHETHER IT WAS TO GO TO FIRST OR SECOND
GRUPPE"

Any ideas as to what "OBLIQUE ARMAMENT" this message refers to?

best regards,

Jim
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Old 4th June 2019, 06:41
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Post Re: "Oblique armament" on a KG 51 Me 262?

maybe this is meant:

Quote:
The definitive night fighter version of the Messerschmitt Me 262, the Me 262B-2, was also designed to carry such an installation but the system was a failure and it was not used operationally.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schräge_Musik

best regards
ghost
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Old 4th June 2019, 10:12
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Re: "Oblique armament" on a KG 51 Me 262?

Here's the text of CX/MSS/T472/49 which identifies the aircraft in question:
CX/MSS/T472/49 BT 5797
Report signed Hilmer, obltn. to KABUS (((Roman) I./KG)) IT. Stamped 1745/23/2:-
Strength return of 23/2
WL port Riedel starter does not function, position otherwise unchanged. Fw. Waldhof left on 23/2. Works No. 110605 with 15 degrees depression of oblique armament. Arrived on 23/2 from Lechfeld (B% request) instructions whether the a/c is to be (C% taken) over by (((Roman) I./KG)) or given up to KADIK (((Roman) II/KG))
NOTE: 1) Seen in file marked KG 51
2) Oblt. Hilmer has signed for the remaining elements of KG 51 at Giebelstadt. (cf. e.g. T469/22). For return of 21st see T470/27.
Then there was this:
CX/MSS/T498/52 BT 8237
((1)) Source saw a document dated 17/3, addressed to Detachment KABUS (( (Roman) I/KG)) 51, Giebelstadt, Oblt. Hilmer, dated 17/3, signed Ltn. Batel.
((2)) To KABUS (( (Roman) I/KG)) 51, Hopsten from Obpfr. Plattner, stamped 2345/19/3:
Strength return of 19/3: BB, HH, LL, ML, IL, AK, LK serviceable. GK, 110620, OL and 11199(smudge) shot up by a/c armament, 110605 with oblique armament shot up by a/c armament on 19/3 and completely destroyed. A/c was for KADIK (( (Roman) II/KG)).
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Old 4th June 2019, 10:36
Karoband Karoband is offline
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Re: "Oblique armament" on a KG 51 Me 262?

Wow! Thank you so much, Nick.

If 110605 was "shot up by armament on 19/3 and completely destroyed" it is not the aircraft shot down on 22 March.

Unfortunately this leads to exposing my ignorance and asking what was KADIK II/KG?

Jim
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Old 4th June 2019, 10:45
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Re: "Oblique armament" on a KG 51 Me 262?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karoband View Post
Wow! Thank you so much, Nick.

Unfortunately this leads to exposing my ignorance and asking what was KADIK II/KG?
One of a series of standard five-letter codes for various types of unit. For the elements of a Kampfgeschwader these were:
KABEK = KG
KABUS = I./KG; KADIK = II./KG; KADOP = III./KG; KAFAN = IV./KG
KEBAD = 1./KG; KEBUT = 2./KG; KEDAC = 3./KG KEDNI = 4./KG; KEFUO = 5./KG; KEGIA = 6./KG; KEKOD = 7./KG; KELAP = 8./KG; KELOA = 9./KG; KEMAB = 10./KG; KEMNO (or KEMMO?) = 11./KG; KENEP = 12./KG.
There are more examples here: http://www.ghostbombers.com/Ultra/ultra_07.html
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Old 4th June 2019, 11:01
Karoband Karoband is offline
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Re: "Oblique armament" on a KG 51 Me 262?

Thank you again, Nick!
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Old 5th June 2019, 01:36
Dan O'Connell Dan O'Connell is offline
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Re: "Oblique armament" on a KG 51 Me 262?

This was an attempt to increase the range of the MK 108, with its low muzzle velocity.
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Old 5th June 2019, 01:38
Dan O'Connell Dan O'Connell is offline
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Re: "Oblique armament" on a KG 51 Me 262?

Jim, that was 111605.
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Old 5th June 2019, 01:48
Karoband Karoband is offline
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Re: "Oblique armament" on a KG 51 Me 262?

Ah! Thank you, Dan. That explains it.
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Old 5th June 2019, 02:30
Dan O'Connell Dan O'Connell is offline
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Re: "Oblique armament" on a KG 51 Me 262?

Glad to help Jim.
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