Navigationsdrehscheibe/compass swing

[Wybe Buising]

Hello all,

can anyone fill in the gaps in my knowledge on the above subject? I am very curious to know what kind of Navigationsdrehscheibe types were in use at Luftwaffe airfields. I know of one type (the ND 12/30 Ae) which was in use at the Gilze Rijen Airfield here in Holland and survived the war. Other airfields also had one.

Were all these Navigationsscheiben of the same type or did there also existed smaller Scheibes for smaller airplanes?

Last question: can anyone explain to me the exact procedure of calibrating an airplane on such a Scheibe. I know there is a manual on the ND12/30AE but don't have it (RLM LD7 IVB).

Best Regards

Wybe

[Pete63]

Wybe,

I've been researching this subject for some three years now and am working on an extensive article on the subject, which will be made public to everyone interested in these Luftwaffe Kompensieranlagen...

I sent you a PM...

Many happy landings!

Piet Bouma
The Netherlands

[John P Cooper]

Piet,

I would be interested in reading this as well!

John

[Jaap Woortman]

Originally Posted by Pete63

Wybe,

I've been researching this subject for some three years now and am working on an extensive article on the subject, which will be made public to everyone interested in these Luftwaffe Kompensieranlagen...
Piet Bouma
The Netherlands

Piet,

Interesting subject.
I have available for everyone a scan of a German WWII article about how to use this 'Kompensierscheibe'.
If you want a copy send me your email address and I send you the article.

Jaap Woortman
Secretary Study Group Airwar 1939-1945.

[SES]

Originally Posted by Wybe Buising

Hello all,

can anyone fill in the gaps in my knowledge on the above subject? I am very curious to know what kind of Navigationsdrehscheibe types were in use at Luftwaffe airfields. I know of one type (the ND 12/30 Ae) which was in use at the Gilze Rijen Airfield here in Holland and survived the war. Other airfields also had one.

Were all these Navigationsscheiben of the same type or did there also existed smaller Scheibes for smaller airplanes?

Last question: can anyone explain to me the exact procedure of calibrating an airplane on such a Scheibe. I know there is a manual on the ND12/30AE but don't have it (RLM LD7 IVB).

Best Regards

Wybe

Hi,
You may find this link useful:
http://www.luftwaffe-experten.org/fo...showtopic=1591
bregds
SES
www.gyges.dk

[Pete63]

SES,

Thanks for posting the link. Yes, do have a look there; what we're looking for is more information / photographs of a Kompensierwaage, which is basically an enormous platform of concrete (about 30 x 30 meters!) of which the centre point can turn. Connected to this central disc are two wooden beams with wheels that turn in the circle around the centre point. The tail gear of the plane is resting on the end of the two beams.

Does anyone have a better picture of such a Kompensierwaage? This is a picture of the Waage at Saint André de L'Eure:



As of now, known locations of Kompensierwaagen that are still (partially) in existence:

Grimbergen (Belgium, near Brussels) - officially declared as a monument, thanks to Frans van Humbeek, who went at great length to see to this..! I provided some AutoCAD drawings of how the Kompensierwaage's actual status is and a drawing of how it (probably) looked like and how it worked - a theory which was confirmed by the location of the "Gradzahlenschilder". I visited Frans and 'his' disc last summer and had a really good chance to study and photograph / measure the disc there.
(Rather complete example, except for the wood, which has disappeared a long time ago).

Brustem (Belgium, aka Saint Trond / Sint Truiden) - currently under investigation by the people of the Brustem Histor Centre. (An extensive part of the concrete is missing, so are the "Gradzahlenschilder", the plates with the magnetic course(s) on them...). Frans van Humbeek will work together with the people of the Brustem Histor Centre. The taxiway to the disc is also still there.

Karup (Denmark, better known as Grove during WW II); a smaller type of Kompensierwaage - investigated and photographed by SES (thanks again, SES!). The concrete disc and the taxiway to it are still there.

Roggenthin (Germany, a satellite field of Rechlin) - derelict; central part can be recognised.


Another type, mentioned by Wybe here, is the ND 12/30 Ae., which is a Navigationsdrehscheibe with a rather deep foundation (something around two meters) and a wooden disc on a wooden construction, with a diameter of 12 meters.


Surviving examples of the ND 12:

Gilze Rijen (The Netherlands) - a very nice ND 12, of which the wooden construction can still be seen. The "Gradzahlenschilder" are still there; two rows of numbers for "Kompensieren" (calibrating the aircraft compass) and "Funkbeschicken" (calibrating the aircraft radio compass). Status: the people of the Traditiekamer Gilze-Rijen (a small but very interesting museum run by volunteers, which is well worth visiting) are doing a great job in looking after and preserving the ND 12 there. It's located on an active RNlAF Air Force Base, so if you would like to see it for yourself try and make an appointment with the people of the Traditiekamer... I had a very enjoyful stay at the airfield last summer and would like to thank Adriaan van Riel and his colleagues at Gilze for their time and will surely provide them with more info!

Berlin-Staaken (Germany) - here Mario Korczakowski has done a great job in contacting the authorities, after I urged him to put forward a request for Staaken's ND 12 to be declared an official historic monument. He succeeded in this and now it's on the official list of monumental buildings of the Landesdenkmalschutz. Its condition seems to be even a bit better than the one at Gilze-Rijen.

Mielec - probably the only Navigationsdrehscheibe still rather complete (except for the Ausleger - a sort of outrigger - , which is missing or lowered permanently inside the disc..!?), which is still in use with the Mielec aircraft factory..!

There are some more remnants... Please have a look at the thread at LEMB (Luftwaffe Experten Message Board)...


Jaap,

Thanks again for your article "Kapitän Mochow - ein wenig Nautik"; I received this from you some two years ago and this partially helped in understanding exactly how such a Navigationsdrehscheibe worked.

I'll publish the result of my extensive research in due time, so that everyone here at TOCH! and at LEMB and LSP (a 1:32 scale aircraft modelling site) and anyone else interested in aviation history, will be able to read about these different sorts of compass swings or Kompensieranlagen. I haven't completely finished it due to the ongoing research and the attempts at getting the Grimbergen and Berlin-Staaken discs preserved for aviation history; this extensive correspondence and providing the necessary drawings for getting the authorities really interested, were a very rewarding side-kick which delayed my resulting article unfortunately... (No, I'd better say 'fortunately', because these results are far more important!)

I'm working on two scale models now:

Ju 88 on a Kompensierwaage / Ta 152 on an ND12/30Ae.

In my article I'll explain both types by using photographs of these models. In which form I'll publish this, I'm not sure yet... Maybe on TOCH! and LEMB or as a website..? The only thing I am sure of, is that all the information must be available for free, because I have been helped in collecting this info by lots of very helpful fellow aviation enthousiasts!
All these people's e-mail addresses are in my collection - so I can get back to them when there are developments...

Again, for my Belgian friends: if you have any pictures of Kompensierwaagen (the wooden beams construction) - please post them here at TOCH! in Wybe's thread, or post them at LEMB...

At LEMB you will see the picture of a Ju 188F-1, of which I would be very happy to receive a larger and sharper picture... The central part of the Kompensierwaage still remains a mystery, so any picture will be helpful..!

A "thank you all" to the people who have helped me thus far, ends my post here for now. Hope to hear from you more..!

With kind regards,

Many happy landings!

Piet Bouma
The Netherlands

[Wybe Buising]

Hi Everyone, thx a lot for all the great responses. This helps to understand it quit better. Here a picture of the nice scalemodel at the Gilze Rijen Airfields Tradition Chamber and a drawing of the cross section. Interesting enough this unit was not fitted with glass bearings (!) as the one in Belgium was, but with a 'normal' kind of wood gearing.

Regards,

Wybe